The truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth about my last couple of months with my new turbo

    @rabtech thanks for sharing. Please continue to share because your wisdom has made me smarter .... let's be honest you had a blank canvas with me when it comes to turbos but now I know and understand so much more because you and others have shared


    As a member who has no engine knowledge I appreciate what you and so many others have shared. While I don't technically understand why it happened I certainly understand the desire and passion that you have and thus the disappointment you experienced we all experienced.


    If there is ANYTHING I/we can do please know you just need to say and we will move mountains for you - you may be the site owner and administrator but YOU ARE A MEMBER and as a member you are family and we all take care of and move mountains for family because family takes care of and moves mountain for me/us

    Quote from Tripod

    I recommend a supercharger feeding a turbo...
    :thumbsup:

    Supercharger feeding a turbocharger so it can feed the Nitrous Wet Shot directly into the cylinders under 110 PSI "SuperBoost Mode".
    Those little puffs of smoke coming from the exhaust will be the LEAST of his worries
    :00008040::00008172::00008356::00008359:

    Oddly enough. just before I started reading this thread, I was packing up the components for my Hahn Racecraft turbo I had spread across part of my family room floor. I had originally planned to start installing the turbo this week, but decided to wait until after Thanksgiving since I expect to get my 30K mile service around then and I was also hoping my replacement swingarm might miraculously get to my dealer. :) While was re-boxing the pieces, I thought I saw a piece of Styrofoam inside the inter-cooler and was looking inside it, thinking about maybe trying to blow it out with some air or some other way of cleaning it to make sure it was clear.
    I, too, would be devastated to lose a new engine like that. One of my concerns id if something should happen to my current motor, I would be hard-pressed to quickly replace it on my retirement income. I'd probably need to get a job <X to afford a replacement motor, so I can definitely feel @rabtech's pain. In some ways I would have liked to have gotten a supercharger, but the Hahn system was priced much more competitively than any of the SC systems, especially since I got a "Slightly Warm" special! Great deal!
    One of the other reasons I held off starting the Hahn install this week is because I still hadn't ordered an AFR/Boost gauge. I finally decided on an Innovate SCG-1 unit since it can be programmed to detect unsafe AFR/Boost situations.
    @rabtech, did you ever get a boost controller installed? If so, what setup did you select? Again, sorry about you having to go thru this entire experience.

    @BKL I am sure you will love the system once it is installed. If you maintain moderate boost you will not have an issues. If yo get crazy like some of us you just need to pay more attention. We are switching to the innovate as an electronic boost controller. Dave at DDM is working on some final ECU tuning tweaks and the system should be up and running shortly. Initial testing was pretty impressive.

    The more people I meet

    The more I love my Dog!

    I plan on using the lowest boost settings, at least for awhile before moving to anything higher. In any case, I don't plan on ever exceeding the recommended spring combos. I'm not looking for tons more HP because I don't want to be replacing the rear tire ever couple months, just a few more HP to improve acceleration at speed.

    Edited once, last by BKL ().

    Quote from BKL

    I plan on using the lowest boost settings, at least for awhile before moving to anything higher. In any case, I don't plan on ever exceeding the recommended spring combos.

    I am sure you will love it Been running my Hahn system for 10,000 miles never an issue - lots of fun!

    The more people I meet

    The more I love my Dog!

    I hope so! I ordered the pre-modded oil pan. A local installer here has successfully used the Hahn-recommended drill and tap the block with the oil pan in place, but that just scares me too much, even though if I used that approach, I'd want to pour several quarts of oil thru the hole, immediately allowing the oil to drain out. Took me awhile to decide I was willing to deal with the PITA that swapping the oil pan entails, but after studying other folks' efforts, I now feel comforatble with the extra effort.

    Quote from BKL

    Oddly enough. just before I started reading this thread, I was packing up the components for my Hahn Racecraft turbo I had spread across part of my family room floor. I had originally planned to start installing the turbo this week, but decided to wait until after Thanksgiving since I expect to get my 30K mile service around then and I was also hoping my replacement swingarm might miraculously get to my dealer. :) While was re-boxing the pieces, I thought I saw a piece of Styrofoam inside the inter-cooler and was looking inside it, thinking about maybe trying to blow it out with some air or some other way of cleaning it to make sure it was clear.
    I, too, would be devastated to lose a new engine like that. One of my concerns id if something should happen to my current motor, I would be hard-pressed to quickly replace it on my retirement income. I'd probably need to get a job <X to afford a replacement motor, so I can definitely feel @rabtech's pain. In some ways I would have liked to have gotten a supercharger, but the Hahn system was priced much more competitively than any of the SC systems, especially since I got a "Slightly Warm" special! Great deal!
    One of the other reasons I held off starting the Hahn install this week is because I still hadn't ordered an AFR/Boost gauge. I finally decided on an Innovate SCG-1 unit since it can be programmed to detect unsafe AFR/Boost situations.
    @rabtech, did you ever get a boost controller installed? If so, what setup did you select? Again, sorry about you having to go thru this entire experience.

    Hey @BKL , I did get the boost controller installed. I found that the gauge does work to control boost but it does it a bit "to good".


    I will probably post this in a new thread because it needs a little attention and it also could help someone from popping an engine.


    What @MACAWS was taking about wen he mentioned getting some tuning done was this.... We found was that the boost controller actually causes the wastegate to completely close due to having top pressure on the diaphragm and your boost will come up almost instantly and the tune cant adjust for the surge of boost.. Basically if you have the Inovate boost controller you have 2 safe options.


    1. Lets say you want the boost to top out at 10 PSI... You would typically put in 5PSI springs and set the controller to take over at 4psi and carry you on up to 10PSI. If something goes wrong it will drop the boost down to the 5psi spring... You also set the AFR high limit to something like 12.5 AFR. IF during a boosted run your AFR goes above 12.5 (lean) it will drop the boost either by a certain pressure or all the way down to the 5psi spring pressure..


    Here is why this didn't go so well for me. Under pure spring pressure the wastegate would allow for some slowness in the build of boost. I would assume the springs in the wastegate would possibly open a bit and allow for a small "cushion" effect.......PURE GUESS ON MY PART....


    When I removed the 10PSI spring and put in the 5PSI spring and allowed the controller to carry me on up to 10PSI it would build smoothly till the controller kicked in and it would jump to 10PSI from the 5psi start point...


    Now this is cool in theory....... It will give you some serious boost and in my case I actually had 7PSI as my spring and I used the controller to carry me on up to 16PSI. So it would come on quick like everyones turbo system would then when it got to 7PSI it jumped almost instantly to 16PSI. AND this caused the real problem,........ The AFR would immediately dip into the LEAN category because the tune wasn't built around this controller. It was build around a wastegate with pure spring doing the controlling of boost. Its not a flaw. Its just something that was never looked at till lately... When it would go lean it would pogo back to spring pressure (because that is what it is supposed to do when it detects a lean condition.) This means its just not usable safely as it stands unless you try number 2 below.


    So until the ECU is retuned and a "accelerator pump" for lack of a better term is added I cant use the gauge to control my boost. I believe Dave is working with Bob on getting some modifications made to the tune to allow for this lean condition. This means you can use your new Innovate gauge as a AFR and Boost gauge and leave the controller turned off and when we get the tune fixed to allow for some enrichment of fuel you can have Bob retune the ECU


    OR, you can do this ,,, And this isn't perfectly safe in my opinion..


    2. You can put in a higher rated spring and just you the controller to give you a small amount of transition. SO basically you are on spring pressure longer and then you just get a small amount transition. And you still use the controller to monitor for LEAN conditions.. BUT you don't really have any fall back for safety due to the springs being set so high.



    So to recap... You have a very nice controller/gauge. And soon it will be usable to do exactly what you want to do. So go ahead and hook it up correctly... Just turn off the controller portion and put the original springs in the wastegate that you had before the gauge install. Then get in contact with Dave or Bob so that he can get with you when the tune is worked out to allow for the enrichment during the transition. Then after you get the retune all you have to do is kick on the controller and remove some of the spring pressure in the wastegate and make a few setting changes on the gauge...

    Isn't that what I said - LOL

    The more people I meet

    The more I love my Dog!

    Quote from BKL

    I hope so! I ordered the pre-modded oil pan. A local installer here has successfully used the Hahn-recommended drill and tap the block with the oil pan in place, but that just scares me too much, even though if I used that approach, I'd want to pour several quarts of oil thru the hole, immediately allowing the oil to drain out. Took me awhile to decide I was willing to deal with the PITA that swapping the oil pan entails, but after studying other folks' efforts, I now feel comforatble with the extra effort.


    I drilled and tapped my block with great results. I can tell you more about it if you're interested.

    @BKL I have had a "gently used" Hahn turbo for a while now and plan on installing it this winter during the "downtime" season. The ARP head studs are a cheap insurance policy you may want to consider if you haven't already. More than one qualified person (I'm being careful not to quote anyone) has told me they have seen numerous turbo motors with failed head gaskets. And the studs can be installed without removing the head. :thumbsup:
    DISCLAIMER: I am no expert but thanks to this forum I have learned alot and am continuing to learn along the way.

    Quote from harleyujoe

    I know how hard it is for engine building and to trust that person putting it in does everything to the book to make sure install
    and oil was pumped in before startup to verify lubing of engine /turbo.


    Well hope you hear from Henry and you can come to some agreement about engine and can feel comfortable about
    posting ..

    Thanks for the post... I need to add this just for clarity.


    This was purely metal in the intake tract. From the turbo to intercooler and on to the intake. It wasn't a lubrication issue. Turbo is in great shape. Im running it now on my new engine.


    Someone on the dark side said something about an oil analysis.. That means I may have not explained the problem. Oil didn't play a part in any of this issue. The problem was metal that we cleaned out of the intake tract that we later picked out of the rings.

    @StreetDoc, I've never drilled and tapped before and will feel more comfortable swapping the oil pan, even though it is a PITA. Sorry to hear about he problem you ran into with your setup. I must admit that reading your thread gave me pause, especially so since I wanted to have a little more pep when accelerating to pass at Interstate speeds! Guess I'll try to stay at relatively low boost for awhile. I originally planned on going with the Hahn Stage 1 setup to get just a little more powere, but with the "Slightly Warm" specials he's offered the cost is roughly the same for either setup.


    It also sounds like just using the Innovate SCG-1 to monitor Boost and AFR with a realtivley light spring setting is the way to go until the ECU issues get worked out. I had read about some other folks running into problem trying to get everything performing smoothly. I also ordered the PL-1 data logger to try and keep track of what's going on.


    Since I've still got some time before I do the install, I'll need to think about the ARP head-studs and the associated tool to get he proper tightness.

    Quote from BKL

    @StreetDoc, I've never drilled and tapped before and will feel more comfortable swapping the oil pan, even though it is a PITA. Sorry to hear about he problem you ran into with your setup. I must admit that reading your thread gave me pause, especially so since I wanted to have a little more pep when accelerating to pass at Interstate speeds! Guess I'll try to stay at relatively low boost for awhile. I originally planned on going with the Hahn Stage 1 setup to get just a little more powere, but with the "Slightly Warm" specials he's offered the cost is roughly the same for either setup.


    It also sounds like just using the Innovate SCG-1 to monitor Boost and AFR with a realtivley light spring setting is the way to go until the ECU issues get worked out. I had read about some other folks running into problem trying to get everything performing smoothly. I also ordered the PL-1 data logger to try and keep track of what's going on.

    When you start the install I will be glad to give you any help you need. I am fairly familiar with that setup..... :D


    When you get to the point that your pulling your oil pan off to start the install send me a message and I will give you my phone number...


    The Hahn is a great system. And you will love it...