Conservative Politics & Daily Events Discussion

Quote from Bill Martin

Me waiting for the Democrats to shut the hell up !!!

i call BULLSHIT that guys got two feet! Sorry Bill just couldnt control myself Us Canadians are watching the circus south of the border and wondering if you need any more clowns as we have quite a few in our capital also.

Why is this like watching Groundhog Day?

Ok Bill Martin here's a question for our resident attorney. What would have happened if you repeated something and said you didn't know if it was true several times in court? What the hell is Shiff doing?

ALINSKY’s RULES FOR RADICALS 101

The Tactics: Know them and know what Democrats are doing!

* RULE 1: “Power is not only what you have, but what the enemy thinks you have.” Power is derived from 2 main sources – money and people. “Have-Nots” must build power from flesh and blood. (These are two things of which there is a plentiful supply. Government and corporations always have a difficult time appealing to people, and usually do so almost exclusively with economic arguments.)

* RULE 2: “Never go outside the expertise of your people.” It results in confusion, fear and retreat. Feeling secure adds to the backbone of anyone. (Organizations under attack wonder why radicals don’t address the “real” issues. This is why. They avoid things with which they have no knowledge.)

* RULE 3: “Whenever possible, go outside the expertise of the enemy.” Look for ways to increase insecurity, anxiety and uncertainty. (This happens all the time. Watch how many organizations under attack are blind-sided by seemingly irrelevant arguments that they are then forced to address.)

* RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.” If the rule is that every letter gets a reply, send 30,000 letters. You can kill them with this because no one can possibly obey all of their own rules. (This is a serious rule. The besieged entity’s very credibility and reputation is at stake, because if activists catch it lying or not living up to its commitments, they can continue to chip away at the damage.)

* RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions. (Pretty crude, rude and mean, huh? They want to create anger and fear.)

* RULE 6: “A good tactic is one your people enjoy.” They’ll keep doing it without urging and come back to do more. They’re doing their thing, and will even suggest better ones. (Radical activists, in this sense, are no different that any other human being. We all avoid “un-fun” activities, and but we revel at and enjoy the ones that work and bring results.)

* RULE 7: “A tactic that drags on too long becomes a drag.” Don’t become old news. (Even radical activists get bored. So to keep them excited and involved, organizers are constantly coming up with new tactics.)

* RULE 8: “Keep the pressure on. Never let up.” Keep trying new things to keep the opposition off balance. As the opposition masters one approach, hit them from the flank with something new. (Attack, attack, attack from all sides, never giving the reeling organization a chance to rest, regroup, recover and re-strategize.)

* RULE 9: “The threat is usually more terrifying than the thing itself.” Imagination and ego can dream up many more consequences than any activist. (Perception is reality. Large organizations always prepare a worst-case scenario, something that may be furthest from the activists’ minds. The upshot is that the organization will expend enormous time and energy, creating in its own collective mind the direst of conclusions. The possibilities can easily poison the mind and result in demoralization.)

* RULE 10: “If you push a negative hard enough, it will push through and become a positive.” Violence from the other side can win the public to your side because the public sympathizes with the underdog. (Unions used this tactic. Peaceful [albeit loud] demonstrations during the heyday of unions in the early to mid-20th Century incurred management’s wrath, often in the form of violence that eventually brought public sympathy to their side.)

* RULE 11: “The price of a successful attack is a constructive alternative.” Never let the enemy score points because you’re caught without a solution to the problem. (Old saw: If you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the problem. Activist organizations have an agenda, and their strategy is to hold a place at the table, to be given a forum to wield their power. So, they have to have a compromise solution.)

* RULE 12: Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions. (This is cruel, but very effective. Direct, personalized criticism and ridicule works.)

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The problem for the dems is that the President spent a large chunk of his life as one of their elites, embedded in their system...... so knows their tactics and plays to them .....

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Counselor, how many times have you told Angie that you had to work late, when you were really going out with the guys for some fine Bourbon and cigars? That never came back to bite you did it?

Quote from Bill Martin

Sadly I have been in that courtroom arguing many a case - still lookin for that first win 😩😩

I'd say throwing yourself on the mercy of the court is as good as you can do there.

Quote from Bill Martin

I guess I could say “people know Schiff is an asshole - but we don’t know for sure” - if you said it enough would people believe it ??

I heard it once,.....................(I believe it to be true)

That guy creeps me out.

He has crazy eyes.

Who elected this bizarre dude??

I am still confused by Rep. Schiff’s repeated claim that Trump must be impeached for attempting to interfere in the 2020 election. I know that Jen Rubin, Bill Kristol, and the wider NeverTrump universe are in near-orgasmic agreement with whatever Schiff says in his anointed role as Trump-Slayer-in-Chief (a title formerly held by Robert Mueller) but I find the logic of this particular charge convoluted. I don’t get it.

Let’s assume that the leadership of Ukraine capitulated to the pressure they did not know was being applied and began the investigations that Trump had requested (which have not yet begun and for which inaction there was never a consequence as would be expected in a quid pro quo— but never mind that now). [Note: See Comment #4 from @kozak below Turns out they were already investigating prior to the Trump request.]

If the investigation were to find nothing, then Mr. Biden not only suffers zero adverse political consequences but could then argue that he and his family were unfairly targeted—a political plus for being a victim. The only way Trump gains an advantage is if the Bidens are in fact dirty, i.e., the absurdly exorbitant payments to Biden the younger did, in fact, purchase the desired influence and protection from Biden the Elder in his role as point man for the US on Ukraine policy. Given the broad, detailed involvement of the Obama administration in the selection of investigative targets subject to Ukrainian anti-corruption law enforcement, it is entirely reasonable to believe that such an investigation is warranted and would be fruitful.

To be clear, Trump could only meaningfully affect the 2020 election if the Bidens are, in fact, dirty as revealed by further investigation. So, Schiff’s charge comes down to a really weird assertion that the President of the United States had no right (despite a treaty of express cooperation in investigative matters) to request/demand an investigation of apparent wrongdoing involving Americans if one or more of those Americans had a reasonable shot at securing the nomination of the Democratic Party, no matter how reasonable such an investigative request would be otherwise.

But let’s further assume that President Trump was gleeful at the prospect of a scandal bringing down his prospective rival. If there are other lawful considerations at work in delaying the aid, does the existence of this allegedly impure motive negate them? If he is antagonistic to and suspicious of Ukrainians in general for their overt assistance to the Clinton campaign and their widespread corruption, and he believes that such corruption is ongoing and pervasive, can he delay aid while insisting on a demonstration of serious anti-corruption actions of which the Biden investigation would be only a part? (Past presidents have tried to impound or delay spending they believed to be wasteful or misguided, including Obama, and have imposed conditions on its release. Not usually lawful but never regarded as a high crime until now.)

The transcripts of the phone calls (which Schiff clearly did not expect to be released) did not include a quid pro quo, yet in the Schiffian mental universe, we know it was there, somewhere in Trump’s mind because it had to be. The “whistleblower” had provided Schiff with an inaccurate, third-hand account of the phone call which formed the basis for the Schiff Impeachment drive. This continued despite expressly contrary evidence and a distinct lack of factual support because we know that bad intent thing is somewhere in Trump’s mind, which also helps explain why the search for evidence will be eternal.

We need to be clear that, because there were no unlawful actions, the prosecution has to come up with some kind of corrupt, unlawful intent behind otherwise lawful actions. The dispositive fact is that if President Trump reasonably believed the Bidens are dirty and an investigation was warranted on the facts, then it was not possible to have an improper intent, even if he simultaneously thought there was a potential political benefit in uncovering their bad actions.

The mental gymnastics required to ignore this simple truth and stay in Orange-Man-Bad mode must be tiring. It is certainly tiresome.

sure wish I could take credit for this posting, but I'm sure Schiff would try to find me and have me disclose where the leak came from

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Great point,

To be clear, Trump could only meaningfully affect the 2020 election if the Bidens are, in fact, dirty as revealed by further investigation.

Also worth consideration, Everything being the same and the corruption in question (assuming corruption took place) was performed (or assumed to be) by anyone other than the Bidens would this impeachment be happing or would it be appropriate for the president to look the other way and freely give our countries money and supplies?

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OK.. so that happened ....

For anyone who missed it don't ask ...

Just be grateful its over an ended on a good note ....

Hopefully we can get back to poking fun and respectful discussions instead of attacking each other or anyone taking stuff posted on the Interwebs personally ... I feel it would also be best to keep it here where it belongs ...

IMO Saturdays preamble by the Presidents representatives was brilliant and I am looking forward to more today ...

And away we go ....

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Quote from Bill Martin

Now that we are moving into a very heated election cycle with very polarized opinions I would like to throw this out there. This thread has been going strong since the last Presidential election. It is in my opinion everyone has been respectful and devoid of personal attacks throughout save and except a few way back. While most of us are of the same opinions we have always welcomed opposing views. Last election cycle we had a few “trolls” that joined the conversation just to try to get “under our skin”. We should go toe to toe with anyone you think you have a better argument against but keep it civil as we always have. I’m sure we will have more left leaning comments as election time draws closer. I look forward to spirited debate as that is a cornerstone of our democracy. Let us continue to show we conservatives will ply ideas and debate issues the way we have for the last four years - allowing folks with opposing ideas to keep their dignity with full respect shown. I’m sure we will be tested - I know I sure was during the last election!!

Screw that! I wanna see DC put up a WWE wrestling ring so they can go at it like the wrestling boys do. POW! BANG! WHOOP! Tired a watching a bunch a sissies ragging on each other. This thread will never survive without it. I'd hate to see everybody here dying from iron poor blood and malnutrition because they didn't get a proper amount of political fix.

Watching the defense today and especially within the last hour . The defense lawyers tearing the house managers case into shreds. They're also pointing out what Obama did in 2012 to influence the election using Russia. Very interesting!!

Quote from Bill Martin

I am starting to see why the younger generation is all for socialism... I know every older generation says the younger is screwing everything up but DAMN ...

https://www.iflscience.com/hea…ls-and-men-are-not-happy/

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