Regarding all the crap going on in Israel and Gaza... These two headlines are now appearing...

Israeli official says government cannot confirm babies were beheaded in Hamas attack

The Israeli government has not confirmed the specific claim that Hamas attackers cut off the heads of babies during their shock attack on Saturday, an Israeli official told CNN, contradicting a previous public statement by the Prime Minister’s office.

“There have been cases of Hamas militants carrying out beheadings and other ISIS-style atrocities. However, we cannot confirm if the victims were men or women, soldiers or civilians, adults or children,” the official said.

Israeli official says government cannot confirm babies were beheaded in Hamas attack (yahoo.com)

And

Egypt warned Israel of Hamas strike days before attack: GOP chair

Egypt warned Israel of Hamas strike days before attack: GOP chair (yahoo.com)

As is usually the case with the media... What to believe and what is spin?

I personally dont think there is any excuse for a terrorist style attack on civilian targets - - - if you think the government of another country harmed you then attack that governments infrastructure or military targets, but attacking a music festival and taking hostages? - - - NO!! not acceptable, never!

As much as Pearl Harbor sucked, it was a legitimate military target, Attacking civilians is not and it is never justifiable no matter what the government of those civilians might be guilty of

JMO

Quote from Edward Neal

I personally dont think there is any excuse for a terrorist style attack on civilian targets - - - if you think the government of another country harmed you then attack that governments infrastructure or military targets, but attacking a music festival and taking hostages? - - - NO!! not acceptable, never!

As much as Pearl Harbor sucked, it was a legitimate military target, Attacking civilians is not and it is never justifiable no matter what the government of those civilians might be guilty of

JMO

I agree with that completely... However our country is one of the most guilty of doing that...

My grandparents died during allied bombing of Germany.. My mom was somehow spared and only 13 years old. This happened both in Germany and Italy.... not even going to go to the fire bombings of Tokyo and of course the two big ones... Hiroshima and Nagasaki.....

Quote from billythekidd

I agree with that completely... However our country is one of the most guilty of doing that...

My grandparents died during allied bombing of Germany.. My mom was somehow spared and only 13 years old. This happened both in Germany and Italy.... not even going to go to the fire bombings of Tokyo and of course the two big ones... Hiroshima and Nagasaki.....

all in declared wars started by the other side

Quote from Edward Neal

all in declared wars started by the other side

Rhetoric: language designed to have a persuasive or impressive effect on its audience, but often regarded as lacking in sincerity or meaningful content.

Quote from Edward Neal: "Attacking civilians is not and it is never justifiable no matter what the government of those civilians might be guilty of"

I am guessing with your response quoted above you did not mean you previous statement.

Hamas went so far into savagery they destroyed the power of antisemitism.

Quote from billythekidd

Rhetoric: language designed to have a persuasive or impressive effect on its audience, but often regarded as lacking in sincerity or meaningful content.

Quote from Edward Neal: "Attacking civilians is not and it is never justifiable no matter what the government of those civilians might be guilty of"

I am guessing with your response quoted above you did not mean you previous statement.

why do you keep trying to justify what hamas did here? Yes you haven’t come right out and said it, but it has been very clear which side you favor

Quote from Bill Martin

IMHO there has been evil people since the beginning of time and there will be evil long after all of us are gone. We bombed Berlin into submission ending Hitler’s genocide. We dropped the big bomb on Nagesaki and Hiroshima ending WW2. In Vietnam we killed 1.1 million N Vietnamese in that war - and pretty much lost that one. ALL these wars without concern for civilian casualties. My point being is the old saying “war is hell” is literal. Netanyahu has declared war so all bets are off. Hamas attacked Israel and they have the right to defend themselves WITHOUT anyone’s approval or denial. I’ll be waiting for the pundits to begin vilifying Israel when the Israeli ground troops deploy into Gaza racking up a massive body count. It is a proven fact thru time - if you run up and kick the sleeping bear - you better be ready for what follows. I believe Hamas is about to find that out ! If Israel kills a million to ensure their safety - how are they any different from us ??

That should also to gas those tunnels now. That would cure that problem.

Since the dawn of time, man’s inhumanity to man as well documented.

Since the beginning of time man has been kicking ass on his neighbor, and every single country on this planet right now, has that in their history.

War is the biggest business in town. You can sell munitions, or you can short the markets, Unfortunately, there are many in our society, both locally and globally that seek profit through division.

You would think as a race we would’ve outgrown this by now. Seems not.

Quote from Edward Neal

why do you keep trying to justify what hamas did here? Yes you haven’t come right out and said it, but it has been very clear which side you favor

Sometimes peoples assumptions make me laugh. You assume because I want the whole story not the one sided story that I support or justify what the Hamas have done. That is so far from the truth it is almost as false as your statement that attacking civilians is never acceptable regardless of what that government may have done.

People in our country feel they have a solid grasp on what is happening in the world when in in reality they have a media version of what is going on... Me included and that is why I like a larger picture and not tunnel vision. We sit here in our comfortable homes, able to eat and drink whatever we want without a second thought. A lot of people around the world do not have this luxury. We sit here and say things like they voted for Hamas, I guess one could look at us and say they voted for Biden, or contrarily Trump and so on...

Certainly condemn Hamas for what they have and will in the future will do. You do realize to a great portion of the people of the world America is thought of as terrorists.. right... We do things like fund Osama only to later call him a terrorist. We fund rebels in Syria who are known to be terrorists also but they serve or "current" purpose of trying to overthrow a very corrupt Syrian "government" which is supported by Russia and Iran... Cold war mentality. We attacked Iraq because of Weapons of Mass destruction when clearly there never were any and the people who perpetrated 911 were mostly Saudi and not from Iraq.

We have tried to stick our noses into areas like Mogadishu and got throughly pushed back. We tried to bomb ISIL for 4 years in Libya.. we all know how that worked out.. Just a few examples of why people hate us because of what (just as you did in your statements) we say and in reality what we do.

Not here on this forum, but on others I was belittled for making statements when my Marine brothers were in Fallujah that if they took fire from a Mosque they should destroy that Mosque... If they took fire from a school they should destroy that school, hospital, or whatever...There should be no safe zone that the enemy should be allowed to hide in... I get war, my stepfather was in WWII and Korea received a silver star and two purple hearts with clusters... My mom lived through the bombing of Munich, so I from their experiences understand what war is like.

Oh well, I am rambling... back to your ludicrous statement about trying to justify Hamas, I am not... Just want the whole story and not the abridged Readers Digest version.

Quote from billythekidd

Sometimes peoples assumptions make me laugh. You assume because I want the whole story not the one sided story that I support or justify what the Hamas have done. That is so far from the truth it is almost as false as your statement that attacking civilians is never acceptable regardless of what that government may have done.

People in our country feel they have a solid grasp on what is happening in the world when in in reality they have a media version of what is going on... Me included and that is why I like a larger picture and not tunnel vision. We sit here in our comfortable homes, able to eat and drink whatever we want without a second thought. A lot of people around the world do not have this luxury. We sit here and say things like they voted for Hamas, I guess one could look at us and say they voted for Biden, or contrarily Trump and so on...

Certainly condemn Hamas for what they have and will in the future will do. You do realize to a great portion of the people of the world America is thought of as terrorists.. right... We do things like fund Osama only to later call him a terrorist. We fund rebels in Syria who are known to be terrorists also but they serve or "current" purpose of trying to overthrow a very corrupt Syrian "government" which is supported by Russia and Iran... Cold war mentality. We attacked Iraq because of Weapons of Mass destruction when clearly there never were any and the people who perpetrated 911 were mostly Saudi and not from Iraq.

We have tried to stick our noses into areas like Mogadishu and got throughly pushed back. We tried to bomb ISIL for 4 years in Libya.. we all know how that worked out.. Just a few examples of why people hate us because of what (just as you did in your statements) we say and in reality what we do.

Not here on this forum, but on others I was belittled for making statements when my Marine brothers were in Fallujah that if they took fire from a Mosque they should destroy that Mosque... If they took fire from a school they should destroy that school, hospital, or whatever...There should be no safe zone that the enemy should be allowed to hide in... I get war, my stepfather was in WWII and Korea received a silver star and two purple hearts with clusters... My mom lived through the bombing of Munich, so I from their experiences understand what war is like.

Oh well, I am rambling... back to your ludicrous statement about trying to justify Hamas, I am not... Just want the whole story and not the abridged Readers Digest version.

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not assuming a damn thing - just reading your posts and it is very clear by you own words that you want to blame Israel as the root cause of the events - - your even doing it right here and I quote "to a great portion of the people of the world America is thought of as terrorists." - - apparently its people like you!!

and with this I am done with you - you are a traitor! and if not a trator than at the very least a terrorist sympithizer and I dont waste my time with the likes of you

We can't confirm that Hamas terrorists cut off the heads of babies. So killing those babies is ok as long as their heads weren't cut off?

Hamas has a goal, the death of all Jews (that includes babies as we have seen). Anything less than that is not acceptable to Hamas.

I see the attempt to say the Palestinians aren't Hamas. That's like saying Americans aren't Democrats or Republicans, Hamas in Gaza is made up of Palestinians.

One of the first rules of war is to dehumanize your enemy to make it easier to kill them. Just look at some of the posters from World War II.

This conflict is no different. Both sides are doing it.

Another thing about war that I never understood is the “ rules of war”. War always is and should be the last result. Once you go, Roman, the goal is to kill and break things faster than your enemy and be the best at it. After the dust settles then you can work things out. Thus the term to the victor go the spoils. If someone is trying to kill you, you will use everything at your disposal to defend yourself. That goes for on the battlefield and in the living room of your own home The thought of leaving some weapons out of bounds mystifies me. Once you declare war that ship has sailed.

And in every war each side will blame the other, and have their own particular reasons. It usually boils down to money and power. The crazy thing is both of those will be lost to the Victor one day and passed on to another. They are fleeting.

All on Friday the 13th. Welcome to Jihadoween

day of rage. Pray for Peace.