Conservative Politics & Daily Events Discussion

    @BONES, arguing with @Sling Beast is wasting your time.
    He probably believes that Obama really was born in Hawaii, :00008040:
    is not a muslim sympathizer, :00008084:
    did not lie on his college paperwork :00008185:
    believes that Obama's birth "certificate" that was produced is ACTUALLY LEGIT :00008356:
    Thinks that being a "community organizer" is qualified to be president, but believes a business man that does business internationally is not. :00006725:
    Believes that Hillary did not lie, has never lied, and will never lie, about anything. :whistling:
    Believes the Clinton Foundation is totally legit and should be a charitable deduction for their tax writeoff. :00000436:
    Believes that Bill "did not have sexual relations with that woman" :00000461:
    Does not believe that Hillary is a closet lezbo :00009419:
    And finally, believes that Hillary's past is all made up and does not believe the "bad stuff" he hears could possibly be true BUT believes every single thing that comes up about Trump regardless if there is evidence or not,
    believes Hillary is honest as the day is long,
    believes Hillary always makes decisions that is best for the people, not the Clintons,
    and believes that the freebies that the democrats give away does not come from hard working people, but just falls out of the sky from the glittering rainbow that Obama made because "you didn't make that".
    :00008862::00007991::00008014::00000007:

    We have a good solid core of good, open minded people here, Great people here, don't be that thorn! It's in approach & way things are presented & comments that get things ugly!


    Just food for thought , opinions are like asses, but some comments can get a negative reaction & come backs.


    We can discuss in good manner, and have in this thread with no cut throat thus far.
    Think some of the comments/ come backs are getting negative reactions..

    I Have No more toys, just memories.... :/

    As we all know both candidates suck.
    If your being honest it doesn't matter who wins as our lives wont be affected much if at all.
    Your not going to lose your guns, that wall isn't going to be built, taxes will remain very close to where they are at, job creation comes and goes the president doesn't help or hurt the matter for the most part, we will always have some kind of war going on as there is big money to be spent & gained from it..... it really simply doesn't matter.


    Now as a funny thing I watched a show where a guy went to home depot or the likes and hired 6 illegal immigrants, took them to a remote area and had them build a 20' long wall exactly like what is on our border today. One of the immigrants said "again" suggesting he helped build the original wall lol. Anyway it took them a couple of days to get it built, then they were set up in teams of 2, one team goes over the wall, one team goes through the wall, & the other team goes under that wall. All 3 teams successfully got to the other side of the wall. The funny part was it took 2 days to build & only 5 to 10 minutes or less to get to the other side.

    He probably believes that Obama really was born in Hawaii-Most Americans do


    is not a muslim sympathizer-This is pure fiction-Faux News fact I assume


    did not lie on his college paperwork-Irrelevent.No one I went to college with was honest on their application


    believes that Obama's birth "certificate" that was produced is ACTUALLY LEGIT-Most Americans believe this


    Thinks that being a "community organizer" is qualified to be president, but believes a business man that does business internationally is not-Not accurate. Ignores years of political experience


    Believes that Hillary did not lie, has never lied, and will never lie, about anything-Politicians ALL lie. It's how they get elected. If they were honest, the system would flush them long before they get a presidential nomination


    Believes the Clinton Foundation is totally legit and should be a charitable deduction for their tax writeoff-Hey-This one is probably not believable by anyone. Score: 1


    Believes that Bill "did not have sexual relations with that woman-Nobody cares where Willy's Willie goes.


    Does not believe that Hillary is a closet lezbo-Again...don't care. Most people don't


    And finally, believes that Hillary's past is all made up and does not believe the "bad stuff" he hears could possibly be true BUT believes every single thing that comes up about Trump regardless if there is evidence or not-I know a lot of Hillary supporters who will be pinching their noses as they vote...just like Trump supporters. they are all crooked. It's just a matter of whose views fall closer to anyone's personal agenda/beliefs


    believes Hillary is honest as the day is long-See above. No one believes this. But if you believe you are voting for an honest candidate in any election-you are wrong.


    believes Hillary always makes decisions that is best for the people, not the Clintons-No candidate does. Personal interest is what dirves both parties


    and believes that the freebies that the democrats give away does not come from hard working people, but just falls out of the sky from the glittering rainbow that Obama made because "you didn't make that"-"All those Freebies" have been drastically over-blown by Faux News. Most of the people I know on Welfare and assistance are Wal-Mart employees.

    @Ghostwheel "MOST OF THE PEOPLE I KNOW ON WELFARE AND ASSISTANCE ARE WALMART EMPLOYEES". Really??? I know from previous posts that you are way smarter than that to make such a foolish comment. A lot of people in suburbia never venture into the ghettos that DEMOCRATS have created where generations of families have been on the government check!! Hillary will most surely be more of the same. Isn't it time to try a different direction to try and come up with a plan to help these folks stand on their own feet and contribute to society rather than be a drain. Change is needed but not Obama change!!

    I might not be right but I can sure sound like it

    It's a valid opinion Bill. Funny thing is...I want the same thing (in general) that most of my conservative friends do. The difference is how we believe we can get there. That is why I usually (but not always) vote left. I can't vote Trump under any circumstances though. I just can't. He represents what I view as the real evil in the country...Runaway Capitalism, Oligarchy and Corporate law. So no can do. I don't think this election will even be close unless T seriously turns his shit around. Maybe the GOP should focus on an electable candidate after Hillary's first four. If they pick a moderate, and she does even half as poorly as everyone on this thread seems to think she will do...she will lose 2020 in a landslide.


    And as for the Walmart thing....I don't believe statistics either way, because I have seen reports of both as far as numbers go. But, what I do believe is that their stupidly low wages does allow many of their employees to collect federal benefits...forcing the feds to basically subsidize their employees. In my mind-That's pure evil. So, again, no I don't believe there are a "bunch of free-loaders" out there. I believe that corporate America has driven people to desperate measures, all in the name of cutting costs and increasing profits. Most people who collect aid, don't want it. Hell...my immigrant neighbor (whose runs a lawn mowing business, has the nicest looking house on the block, and a bunch of Hispanic kids running around with Tatts)-hates the fact that he is stereotyped. Most Hispanics don't WANT welfare. They want to work. And they are far better at it that most of us old, soft white guys are.

    Quote from Ghostwheel

    It's a valid opinion Bill. Funny thing is...I want the same thing (in general) that most of my conservative friends do. The difference is how we believe we can get there. That is why I usually (but not always) vote left. I can't vote Trump under any circumstances though. I just can't. He represents what I view as the real evil in the country...Runaway Capitalism, Oligarchy and Corporate law. So no can do. I don't think this election will even be close unless T seriously turns his shit around. Maybe the GOP should focus on an electable candidate after Hillary's first four. If they pick a moderate, and she does even half as poorly as everyone on this thread seems to think she will do...she will lose 2020 in a landslide.


    And as for the Walmart thing....I don't believe statistics either way, because I have seen reports of both as far as numbers go. But, what I do believe is that their stupidly low wages does allow many of their employees to collect federal benefits...forcing the feds to basically subsidize their employees. In my mind-That's pure evil. So, again, no I don't believe there are a "bunch of free-loaders" out there. I believe that corporate America has driven people to desperate measures, all in the name of cutting costs and increasing profits. Most people who collect aid, don't want it. Hell...my immigrant neighbor (whose runs a lawn mowing business, has the nicest looking house on the block, and a bunch of Hispanic kids running around with Tatts)-hates the fact that he is stereotyped. Most Hispanics don't WANT welfare. They want to work. And they are far better at it that most of us old, soft white guys are.

    Your posts are true to what you believe.


    Two quick examples of the welfare state we are in. Both from friends I work with.
    The first is from one who delivered mail for a year and left it because he was being constantly threatened in the rougher areas of Little Rock. On Fridays when the welfare checks were delivered he had multiple houses that received 6 to 8 different welfare checks for children. If there was a check missing they would threaten violence.
    The second came from a high school teacher who truly believed in providing the best for each student. What he witnessed freaks me out to this day. He would identify a student who had great ability but would not complete the required work. After talking to the parents he was floored. He was told to stop trying to help the child because if they completed the required years in school and failed, she would make about $24,000 a year in welfare. Both these examples came from retired military members who are honest people.


    For a short period in my life I managed a store for Target in who's employment base was not in a good area. In most cases whenever I would ask if they wanted some extra hours they turned me down because it would lower their welfare check. The hours I offered them would have allowed them to gain benefits, but that didn't matter to them.
    On a last note. When the Affordable Care Act was established it made it harder for those who wanted the hours to get them. If they took the extra hours their medical benefits subsidy would decrease. Because of this I had to hire more part time staff which in turn lowered everyone else's hours.


    I have lived and worked in an environment where I have seen the abuse of a system that was initially set up to help the down and out. Today that same system provides a life style built around doing nothing for something. There are those that need help, that help should only be there for those who are really in need to help them improve their life.

    And...my experience has been the opposite. It is a large enough country that it is certainly possible. We are both built by our experiences. I am sure you beliefs are valid for who you are and what you have seen...as are mine. Now, the question becomes what is the experience of the "average voter"...which is what usually determines elections.

    As a retired corporate lawyer I many times made legal maneuvers that I felt were morally wrong yet within the confines of current US laws. This was one of the main initiators causing me to tear down and rip up my shingle. In my 30 years of practice I have watched the private, government and judicial moral fabric decay. For instance removal of the Ten Commandments being erased from most governmental properties. These basic principles should not be displayed yet Muslim beliefs should be protected at all costs. You have the right to burn the US Flag but not the right to pray in school. We all can throw rocks at these 2 candidates from here until doomsday but other than Supreme Court picks they will do little to CHANGE anything. The only hope, which has little chance, is not government reform but public reform. We the People are as much to blame for the current social disparity as the government. Many of us here are old enough to have grown up in a time where the family unit was strong, law enforcement was respected, law was something specifically designed to mete out justice not political gain or monetary enhancement from frivolous lawsuits, people had a strong work ethic, and most importantly respected human life. I can agree that depending on your outlook and life experiences how either one of these candidates can be distasteful. But can't we agree both these candidates are really a product of what I have outlined above not being present. They are truly polar opposites but one thing homogonizes them. They are both of questionable character. Forty years ago neither could run for dog catcher as people had a core belief in honesty, integrity, and being proud of the country they made so great. Perhaps going forward these values of the past could very well be our only saviour. I think we all could very well be on a sinking ship if left solely to the cures of the Rep/Dem parties. The government has had 240 years to get things right and have failed us dismally. Then to add insult to injury Trump & Clinton are really the BEST they can come up with to serve us the next 4 - 8 years. It seems pretty clear to me no matter who you vote for in November we all have good reason to hold our nose! Although I am not a great fan of JFK he did have one of the greatest political lines in history IMHO!!

    I might not be right but I can sure sound like it

    I hope the average voter realizes how much his medical costs and taxes have gone up over the past 8 years. I can tell you my taxes, all included, have raised about 13 percent. Do they want to pay out more for the same thing, or take a chance on making a difference. If I remember correctly the current administration was built on hope and change. After 8 years we have a much larger deficit and even more secrets and lies which all the current politicians in office are responsible for. Why are those who desired the hope and change not speaking up? What we have now is truly more of the same, but at a larger scale. Are they happy with the politicians who have made the decisions over the last 8 years?

    I wish I could go there Bill, but I can't really do that either. Just like in your long post earlier, many of the things you claim to be "a problem" are things that I see as "hope". Here is an example.


    I don't want to see the Ten Commandments ANYWHERE. Nor do I want to see anything Muslim, Shinto, Jewish or anything else. Religion is like a penis. I am happy for you if you have a large one, but keep it private please.


    There are things you mention like work ethic, a respect for law enforcement and a respect for human life that I think everyone can agree on. But once again, from my own experience, "strong" family units (which usually equates to an authoritarian parental figure) are part of the problem, not the solution.


    So yes, we do agree that we the people are as much to blame as the elected officials. But what you see as "the path out", I see as a step back. I my Utopian world, religion is not needed. People know the difference between right and wrong, and don't the the crutch of religion (or the fear of burning in hell) to behave with kindness and compassion.


    I am quite proud of this country for all of the progress we have made. For decades we were leading the world with our values, beliefs and ideals. However, the world has changed, and we have not. I now find myself VERY impressed with the thought processes of my European colleagues when I travel there. We have kinda become like the old, doddering uncle who lives in the past and wishes for "what was", while the rest of the family leaves us to wallow in our self pity and marches forward towards a new future. Equality for all (sexual orientation included), Freedom FROM religion (it should be a choice), the government BUTTING OUT of a woman's personal choice (etc). The real problem is, as a people, our personal agendas have been drifting further and further apart. I would blame the media, but we all consume willingly. Maybe no society is meant to last forever...maybe it is our destiny to tear ourselves apart. I just don't know. But what I do know is that I am PERSONALLY responsible (guess that makes me a fake liberal) for the way I treat people, and the way I make them feel. Every time I injure someone...EVEN IF I AM IN THE "RIGHT", will be tallied on my personal karmic balance.


    For me, the path to peace is personal responsibility, which can't be enforced, taught or delegated. We have to own up. This is where my faith in humanity fails. So, all I can do is monitor myself and hope the world does likewise.


    One other note on this Bill, that may help account for our differences-Career.


    You were in Law. Focused on precedent, justice and morality, and measuring behavior by comparing it to law, as well as previous behavior. I grew up in the every changing world of tech. Neither world is more valid than the other, and we need both. But, I do think it contributes to differing agendas.

    If you have not, you should read up on the rise and fall of the Roman Empire!! We are well on our way. As for the Ten Commandments it is religious but is it not the building stones of all laws in a civilized society - that is bad? @Ghostwheel you are a card carrying liberal and I the opposite. That being said I commend you on being able to articulate your beliefs and values without sinking to insults and personal attacks - many liberals can't. I don't think we can find much common ground but I respect you pushing your agenda on this largely conservative setting civilly!! Well done my friend.

    I might not be right but I can sure sound like it

    Thank you sir! You articulate well too. Although I am gonna deny the card carrying liberal moniker. I have a few friends who have that honor, and I have to constantly remind them that my path, is not their path.

    Here’s a very scary thought…………..

     What if Hillary Clinton wins the election in November, then, sometime between November and January, Hillary is indicted.

    The IRS is still investigating the Clinton Foundation and the whole e-mail thing isn’t over yet. Once under indictment she won’t be able to assume the Office of the President in January. Tim Kaine, who will not actually be the Vice President because neither he nor Hillary have been inaugurated, cannot assume the Presidency.

     The Speaker of the House can’t move up to it because there is already a sitting President and Vice President. So President Obama, in an Executive Order citing “emergency situation,” gives himself another four years in office.

     Is it possible that Obama has been planning this for a while now, knowing he has enough on Hillary to indict her. Had the Attorney General indicted her based on evidence from the FBI this plan wouldn’t have worked because the DNC would have quickly come up with another candidate.

     Do you think that this too outrageous? Many people on the left, including the President, want Obama to stay another four years. The law prohibits him from being re-elected so the only ways he can do it is by declaring martial law and suspending the election (which would be a very negative thing for the country) or to declare himself still President because the elected candidate cannot assume her duties.

     The latter makes more sense and is actually more feasible. And since it’s never been done before, it would set a precedent that would be difficult to challenge.

     Of course, if Trump wins the election none of this is going to happen. But what if it did? Four more years of Obama and a mostly useless Republican House and Senate would give Obama the time he needs to continue destroying the country to fit his stated goals. Is it possible?

    Nobody gets outta here ALIVE