Oil Pan & RTV questions

  • OK. I installed my Hahn-modded oil pan last week, but it looks like I have an oil leak. I haven't yet added new oil to the pan, but since I'm working in an open carport and we had rain after I installed the new pan, I had a chance to watch for potential leaks/dripping. While I had the pan off, I noticed oil was leaking down on top the bottom of the engine block and wiped it off several times over the course of a month. After I installed he new pan, I noticed some oil had dripped down onto a cardboard piece I had placed underneath the pan. The leak was in the area where the 4 bolts connect the pan to the bell-housing. I moved the cardboard and then only detected oil at one spot near one of the center bolts connecting the pan to the bell-housing. After moving the cardboard again, I saw oil appeared to have dripped from the same spot. The spot appears to be in the same location where I had placed a finger while trying to manipulate the pan into position and I pulled the pan out and added some more Permatex Optimum Grey RTV to the spot I had disturbed with my finger. One final comment as part of the background- I have assume the spots on the cardboard are from oil, but it rained a lot last week and there is a possibility that the spots might have been caused by condensation forming on the engine block and oil pan and might have picked up some oily dirt from the outside of the engine, making the spots look like they're oil leaks. I haven't noticed any new spots since a couple days after I installed the oil pan


    Since it looks like I need to pull the pan, clean both mating surfaces (PITA) and then reapply RTV, I now have a question. I noticed while trying to maneuver the oil pan into position that it seems more likely to accidentally scrape some RTV off while trying to get the pan into place since the bolts securing the crankshaft stick done below the edges of the oil pan. This made me wonder about applying the RTV to the bottom of the block, but this means trying to apply the RTV upwards against the bottom of the engine block. This would also be difficult trying to get he RTV into place along the back of the block in front of the flywheel. Permatex offers some of their RTV products in a cartridge to fit in a caulking gun which looks like it would be easier to apply to the engine block while lying on my back under the Slingshot. I used Permatex Optimum Grey RTV the first time and it was a pain to squeeze the RTV out of the tube (the tube sprang a leak and oozed out all over some of my fingers).


    Now comes my questions -


    Question # 1 - Should I go ahead and pull the oil pan and redo the RTV before proceeding with the turbo installation or should I complete the install and hope for the best after I add oil later? I assume it would be easier to redo the oil pan before I finish installing the turbo. I'm just not looking forward to the PITA process of pulling the pan (simple), cleaning off the old RTV (no fun) and then manipulating the pan and fresh RTV back into place and tightening things down (PITA).


    Question # 2 - Permatex does NOT offer their Optimum Grey RTV (700F temp rating) in a cartridge, only their older Ultra Black and Ultra Grey (both with 500F temp rating). I was originally going to use the Ultra Grey RTV before I learned of the higher rated Optimum Grey RTV and decided to use it. How important is it to have the extra 200F temp resistance provided by the Optimum Grey RTV? After all, the Ultra line was Permatex' best product for many years. The cartridge should make it easier to apply the RTV to the bottom of the engine block or I can use the newer Optimum product and apply it to the oil pan and just try to be careful I don't accidentally disturb the RTV while manipulating the oil pan into position.


    Question # 3 - By the time I get the oil pan pulled and reinstalled and then can finish the turbo installation my engine will have been sitting for over a month and a half with whatever oil was left on the cylinder walls and around the rings, etc. having had lots of time to drain away. Should I try to do anything beyond just adding fresh oil before attempting my first start with the turbo installed? My main concern is how long the engine will crank before oil gets sucked up into the oil intake tube and into the pump to get oil to the engine internals.


    Just looking for opinions before I proceed. :D

  • First thing.... before you start an engine that has not been started in a while you can unplug the harness that feeds the fuel injectors and coils and then hold your starter button in till it stops cranking. Do this two or three times to prime the oil.


    Your oil pan should never be any hotter than 200 to 300 degrees. Remember it's just holding oil that has just went thru an engine that hopefully is running around 190 to 210 degrees. And the only reason it would be hit super hot conditions is after the engine was turned off and it started to heat up because the flow of coolant stopped. Engines get hotter right after they are shut off.

  • Jack the engine up again and pull the pan. Clean it off once more and clean the block side up again. Once its clean use a rag with rubbing alcohol to make the surfaces oil free and ready for the gasket goo. Always pull the pan back off if you have any doubt that it's going to leak. While you have the oil pan off you can carry it to a bench grinder and make a notch in the bottom of the pan that will help a lot with reinstalling it. I will post some pictures when I find them shortly. It's not required to install the pan but it makes it sooooooo much easier.

  • Just thinking outside the box. Have you had to add any fluid to your clutch reservoir?

    I'm ashamed to admit I've never even checked it. Clutch has always seemed to work fine.

    First thing.... before you start an engine that has not been started in a while you can unplug the harness that feeds the fuel injectors and coils and then hold your starter button in till it stops cranking. Do this two or three times to prime the oil.


    Your oil pan should never be any hotter than 200 to 300 degrees. Remember it's just holding oil that has just went thru an engine that hopefully is running around 190 to 210 degrees. And the only reason it would be hit super hot conditions is after the engine was turned off and it started to heat up because the flow of coolant stopped. Engines get hotter right after they are shut off.

    I was concerned about starting the engine before oil could get circulated. I was used to working on carbureted vehicles and was wondering about the FI system. Thanks.
    I asked about the oil temps simply because Permatex used the 500F RTV line for years. I thin I may try the Ultra Grey or Black in a cartridge since it will allow me to more easily apply the RTV to the bottom of the engine block and avid scraping any RTV if the pan should bump the lower engine block. The cartridges cost a little more, but after having the tube ooze all over my fingers, I think the cartridge will be easier to apply. and cleaner.

    Jack the engine up again and pull the pan. Clean it off once more and clean the block side up again. Once its clean use a rag with rubbing alcohol to make the surfaces oil free and ready for the gasket goo. Always pull the pan back off if you have any doubt that it's going to leak. While you have the oil pan off you can carry it to a bench grinder and make a notch in the bottom of the pan that will help a lot with reinstalling it. I will post some pictures when I find them shortly. It's not required to install the pan but it makes it sooooooo much easier.

    Overnight, I realized it would definitely be easier to fix any possible oil leak before I install the rest of the turbo since I would need to disconnect the turbo tubing as well as removing the exhaust and possibly the exhaust manifold.

    AND STOP OVER THINKING IT... :D

    Over-thinking something is a natural consequence of knowing just enough to wonder if I need to know more. :/ I had been hoping to get some assistance from my neighbor, a high school auto shop teacher, but he always seems too busy and hasn't responded to earlier requests for his opinion, so I have come to rely on this community for its help.

    I included 3 pics of the oil pan. The 1st picture shows my leak! The 2nd pic is the front of the oil pan. I don't see any rib(s) to remove there. The 3rd pic shows the rear portion of the pan. There are 4 ribs with the 2 center ribs sticking down a little more than the outer ones. Are these the ribs you were referring to grinding down? IF so, should I just grind the center ribs so they are similar to the outer ribs or should I also remove some of the outer ribs near the rear as well? I understand that the ribs strengthen the pan which is a stressed member of the lower engine block when attached, so I assume I shouldn't go hog-wild with the rib-grinding.
    we're expecting possibly heavy rain over the next few days, so I'm not sure how soon I'll get started on pulling the pan again.
    Thanks to the both of you for your comments/assistance.