Impeachment, let your Senator Know

    Thanks for giving an indication of being open to discussion. First, I want to say, there is a key witnesses that has a huge input to what happened. That is John Bolton. He is now a citizen and not a member of the cabinet. He is a private citizens with all the powers of a private citizen. He also has express he wants to testify if called. The President has no power over blocking him from testifying. He only has power over the people in his cabinet. He can not block documents from the Pentagon, and other departments that have documents that show the things that were ordered. I just want what is available without the powers of the presidents executive privilege. There are enough areas that can be produced that he can not block that will give all of America just what they need to know if this was evidence to support the charge. That is all I ask for.

    I can not see where this would not be what all Americans want to see and hear. The questions do not lead to national security in that it is finding out what evidence will show for the charges submitted by the House.

    I would like to hear from the Main Players under his cabinet, but to preserve executive privilege for future presidents, I will say that I want to keep that power when needed for National Security. I am reluctant to grant that for a President to protect himself from prosecution. Why in the world would any American not want to hear what the closest man to the President has to say?

    Folks, this is the precedence for future presidents that are found in conflict with congress. We need to know exactly what the facts are so the next time, they will have to produce witnesses in the trail. No person can ever convince me that not hearing witnesses that can produce a better view of what happened is what we want to show future trails. Both sides can do direct and cross examinations of the witnesses. Tell me how that is wrong. That is my big argument on this important point of the trial. I am glad you are open to me discussing my views and I want you to clearly explain your position as I have. All Members, I am open to listening to your reasoning.

    Just to set the record straight, I NEVER said all Democrats are out to get Trump. As a group, they are no better or worse than any other Political party that sticks together for the benefit of their party. While you'll hear Shifty Schiff, Schumer the Snake and others baiting the Republicans into voting against the party lines and put their political carrier in jeopardy, I have to wonder why only three Democrats had the integrity to vote their conscience and oppose continuing this farce.

    Nobody gets outta here ALIVE

    Members, I am not the smartest man in the world, I use basic logic and understanding to view things. For the Slingshot I have demonstrated my thinking. I am a helping person with positive thoughts toward everyone. My nature is to help. I am not just someone that contributes nothing to the community. I do my best to share my knowledge to give help if needed. Now my political views are how I feel as I see process going on. I want the truth to be at the forefront. Not a person. Even if I liked Trump, if he is not following the constitution and it can be proved that it is true, then I want to know. I am sorry, I do not think results are the key point. It is what is the intentions of the President and what rules is he following to achieve his results.

    This is what my aim was when I created this thread. I thought we could just debate the issues of the trail as they came up. I was met with no discussion only opinion as to why the house is so wrong. There may be things the house has done wrong. We have an opportunity to see more facts if we open the doors to view them.

    Thanks for listening, I want to hear how I am wrong in my views and why.

    Quote from samowens44

    Thanks for giving an indication of being open to discussion. First, I want to say, there is a key witnesses that has a huge input to what happened. That is John Bolton. He is now a citizen and not a member of the cabinet. He is a private citizens with all the powers of a private citizen. He also has express he wants to testify if called. The President has no power over blocking him from testifying. He only has power over the people in his cabinet. He can not block documents from the Pentagon, and other departments that have documents that show the things that were ordered. I just want what is available without the powers of the presidents executive privilege. There are enough areas that can be produced that he can not block that will give all of America just what they need to know if this was evidence to support the charge. That is all I ask for.

    I can not see where this would not be what all Americans want to see and hear. The questions do not lead to national security in that it is finding out what evidence will show for the charges submitted by the House.

    I would like to hear from the Main Players under his cabinet, but to preserve executive privilege for future presidents, I will say that I want to keep that power when needed for National Security. I am reluctant to grant that for a President to protect himself from prosecution. Why in the world would any American not want to hear what the closest man to the President has to say?

    OK Sam - here is my take away from your thoughts. It would be OK for me to go to Washington DC - obtain a top security clearance knowing some of the President’s and country’s most sensitive information (like John Bolton). Then am fired for disagreement with President, quit, whatever and because I no longer work there everything I heard is fair game in open court. I’m still waiting on my answer on executive privilege YES or NO. You cannot dilute that privilege - it’s either all or none!!!

    I might not be right but I can sure sound like it

    Quote from Bill Martin

    OK Sam - here is my take away from your thoughts. It would be OK for me to go to Washington DC - obtain a top security clearance knowing some of the President’s and country’s most sensitive information (like John Bolton). Then am fired for disagreement with President, quit, whatever and because I no longer work there everything I heard is fair game in open court. I’m still waiting on my answer on executive privilege YES or NO. You cannot dilute that privilege - it’s either all or none!!!

    Yes, executive privilege should should be available to the president. I do not think it can be used to block wrong doing.

    Folks, executive privilege is not meant to be use for avoiding prosecution. In a trail, I feel executive privilege has lost its power. If this is posible, we would never be able to put any president out of office. That is unacceptable. We are now at another super level of our discussion. executive privilege! I want to ask members, can a president use his power of executive privilege to block impeachment trial request for witnesses. If you say yes, then we can never expel a President for wrong doing as we would never be able to prove the facts for the charge. I want to know how you all answer this question. Folks, what if we get a president that is really power hungry and does things really bad for all us. How would we ever get him out with the executive privilege power so great, he can stop any inquiry into his wrong doing. Now think really hard on this question and give me your reasoning and thinking here. I really want to know. Please all members respond with your thoughts, this is a discussion, we are not arguing, we are discussing.

    Quote from Bill Martin

    SOOOO - who decides what is privileged and what is not ?? The opposing party??

    really do not know what the rules for executive privilege are. My reasoning is the President can exicute his power when Nation Defense maters are at stake. To ask you back, do you think the President should be able to block testimony about a crime the president has been accused? Yes or No. Now this is the debate I would waiting for, we are exchanging.

    I have witness so many witnesses testify knowing they were being viewed by the world. They were just doing their job and found themselves in a Crime as they saw it. I can not believe the turmoil they must have gone under to expose themselves to this. I think it took tremendous courage to do it. Many witnesses told of all the things they saw that were totally against the american interest. They are folks that on our side to protect and serve our democrocy for all the people. They have no other interest than to do their job for us. Then they see something wrong and testify about it. Are we to tell them they are lying the President would never do that. It is not one person, it was many that gave testimony that supported it other. What in the world can anyone do to disqualify so many dedicated career folks just doing their job. Please, Please, tell me where I am naive and misunderstanding. This president can do no wrong. All these people are lying. Sometimes we have leaders we like so much we are willing to forgive. When we disrpect the testimony of witnesses as we have seen, we are sending a message to future folks. Would anyone in their right mind ever say a word about wrong doing in the future. Do we want that thinking with all our people at looking out for our best interest in the working people of the government. For me, I do not want to discourage those people. I want them to be praised for their service on my behalf. Without these people tell what they see, we will never hear of wrong doing.

    I ask all of you, Yes or No, do you want that message to be sent?

    Quote from samowens44

    I have witness so many witnesses testify knowing they were being viewed by the world. They were just doing their job and found themselves in a Crime as they saw it. I can not believe the turmoil they must have gone under to expose themselves to this. I think it took tremendous courage to do it. Many witnesses told of all the things they saw that were totally against the american interest. They are folks that on our side to protect and serve our democrocy for all the people. They have no other interest than to do their job for us. Then they see something wrong and testify about it. Are we to tell them they are lying the President would never do that. It is not one person, it was many that gave testimony that supported it other. What in the world can anyone do to disqualify so many dedicated career folks just doing their job. Please, Please, tell me where I am naive and misunderstanding. This president can do no wrong. All these people are lying. Sometimes we have leaders we like so much we are willing to forgive. When we disrpect the testimony of witnesses as we have seen, we are sending a message to future folks. Would anyone in their right mind ever say a word about wrong doing in the future. Do we want that thinking with all our people at looking out for our best interest in the working people of the government. For me, I do not want to discourage those people. I want them to be praised for their service on my behalf. Without these people tell what they see, we will never hear of wrong doing.

    I ask all of you, Yes or No, do you want that message to be sent?

    You mean like the witnesses and documents in the Mueller investigation ?? NO executive privilege there and NOTHING after a 2,year investigation - those were all “good” people also

    I might not be right but I can sure sound like it

    Now, the Mueller Investigation has been brought up as a comparison to "good" people testifying. I want to give my opinion here also. I watch that process also. I knew that was going to be hard to prove that the president had direct input into that charge. That is totally different than this process. We have direct evidence for the president performing the changes against him. This is far more a provable charge if we get to hear all the evidence. There were many witnesses in the Mueller Inquiry that did not get to testify for being blocked by the president. No one can defend this to me. Seeking truth is the way our democracy was formed. It is our base core to keep things right. We have to always put the truth of a case at the front always.

    I hope we get others to put their thoughts to this discussions, I am ready to respond, this is exactly what I want to generate with this thread.

    Quote from samowens44

    Folks, executive privilege is not meant to be use for avoiding prosecution. In a trail, I feel executive privilege has lost its power. If this is posible, we would never be able to put any president out of office. That is unacceptable. We are now at another super level of our discussion. executive privilege! I want to ask members, can a president use his power of executive privilege to block impeachment trial request for witnesses. If you say yes, then we can never expel a President for wrong doing as we would never be able to prove the facts for the charge. I want to know how you all answer this question. Folks, what if we get a president that is really power hungry and does things really bad for all us. How would we ever get him out with the executive privilege power so great, he can stop any inquiry into his wrong doing. Now think really hard on this question and give me your reasoning and thinking here. I really want to know. Please all members respond with your thoughts, this is a discussion, we are not arguing, we are discussing.

    Maybe I'm wrong here in a legal sense of my understanding of executive privilege and if I am someone please let me know.


    My understanding of executive privilege is that the President's closest advisers cannot divulge information that they are privy to because of their position to protect the privacy of those conversations. I don't see executive privilege as a get our of jail free card for this or any other future impeachment action since that testimony is only part of the evidence that they should be able to uncover if a serious offense has occurred. Evidence encompasses much more than just testimony from the President's closest advisers. I understand why the democratic house managers would like to hear from President Trump's advisers under oath, but I also understand why that is a dangerous thing when it comes to national security, foreign policy, etc. Any action that rises to the level of seriousness that it could result in the removal of a sitting President should have evidence trails sufficient to make their case and petition the courts to make a ruling on whether the material is protected or not. If congress feels that the information not available by the President evoking executive privilege there appears to me a remedy for that through the courts (according to my quick read of the wikipedia page). I am not sure why the house did not complete the legal action to determine if executive privilege applied in this case before forwarding it to the senate (my guess is that they were worried that the courts would rule against them). To me this boils down to the democrats saying "we want to know what you discussed with your advisers so we can use it against you" and the President saying "nope, can't have it because it is privileged". The next step, it seems to me, would be to take it to the court for decision. If the court ruled that executive privilege didn't apply in this case and the President ignored that decision then I agree that we would all have something to be up in arms about. However, the House did not pursue that court decision for some reason.


    To me that reason was to further this as a political theater show since they had to know that it would be pretty much impossible to get 2/3 of the senators to agree that what he did was serious enough to remove him from the office (largely because I think this kind of stuff goes on a lot in the deep halls of Washington DC at that level of politics). I don't think either side actually thinks they can remove the President, they just want to leverage the political theater that is going on to further their political party's objectives for the election cycle and are using this to spin up their political bases as the elections get closer. I feel there is a reason why there are so many past quotes from senior member of both parties that state that impeachment should never be undertaken when there isn't bipartisan support in agreement that the offense is serious enough to warrant the removal of a sitting President by a vote from the members of Congress. Seems that several of those involved in this current situation don't feel that is important anymore when the Executive Branch is led by a member from the other political party.

    FB - North Alabama Polaris Slingshot Owners - (Huntsville)

    Folks, you will really know me and my feelings if you have ever watch any of my video about Help with the Slingshot. As I did my video, I go into great detail about how, why and if and when to do something I am trying to explain. I am doing that same thing here, no different. I put the thinking I have to the issues that are before me. I evaluate the main question, look for all the facts and evaluate my position.

    Now, if your position is, to avoid looking at everything and just saying they don't like Trump and trying to railroad him, then you are missing the elements that are necessary to make a real true decision as to a true thought out position. You would be avoiding everything to defend someone that you think is better than another alternative. A Democrat. I feel, most would rather have Trump than to allow a Democrat to be Elected, even if he did do the charges. So why even listen to all of this. You know, this is just what all of you have presented to me as your position, without saying it. Am I right!

    Again, as Bill Martin has established, Yes or No?

    Have you considered that it's not about defending President Trump but about defending the idea the we need to put America First?

    I think he understands the trend towards Socialism is slowly destroying the country. Freely giving away money and resources to countries that snub us and continue to do so just doesn't work. If other countries help themselves were happy to help but not just give (throw away) money. He doesn't buy votes through promising social programs but strives to create jobs allowing a pathway for success and in turn making our country and economy better. Cutting back on costly and needless regulations. Renegotiate bad trade deals that have been taking advantage of the United States for years AND GETTING THEM DONE. Understands that drugs are destroying our country. That our boarders are venerable. We can come up with a better immigration policy that works for everyone. Creating a Space Force for todays needs.


    Mike Bloomberg had a campaign commercial on today. It had one message, I can defeat Donald Trump. No policies or ideas. I heard Elizabeth Warren intends to arrange a team to beat down President Trump even if he wins the election? Is that a great strategy for the country!


    I'm not voting for a person but for the persons ideas and getting them done. The person that has the idea of putting America First. If anyone else had those views I would vote for that person. No one cared to tackle renegotiating any trade deals? Republican or democratic and that matters to me.


    It's not at all about voting for "Trump" at all costs. He is the only one that seems to put our country first (republication or democratic) . As said earlier by others this will also be my last post on this subject.


    Thanks for the opportunity!

    Thanks you for really great presentations of your feels. This is the type of discussions I was hoping for when the idea of following the trail came to me. You have outline some very valid concerns and I full agree with all, I want what you want. I also can imagine, you wished their was another Trump without all his bad traits. Thanks, You gave some really great points that I am sure other will have more to state.