I do not really understand the fuss.
I would imagine even if the numbers are slightly higher with 93 the gains would be proportionate. I will let the experts confirm that because it is just a guess on my part.
You don't have anything to do today?
The Truth About Natural Power - A Look At What Makes Power and How Much
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You don't have anything to do today?
Just waiting for the sun to warm the blacktop enough to get my tire to stick.. Then I will fill up with some 93 and turn it into green house gases!
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Just waiting for the sun to warm the blacktop enough to get my tire to stick.. Then I will fill up with some 93 and turn it into green house gases!
I have the 8 year old grand daughter today, my shadow out of the nine grands. We may get in a short ride today sometime
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This was done on 93.
In reality, I would advise you to stay on the stock tune with 91 and put the money towards boost
kev This was said by Al earlier, which to me seems like he is advising people who run 91oct gas to skip his tune.
I am just asking for clarification on this, I am not bad-mouthing ZZP,being ungrateful for their hard work or in any way trying to pick a fight for no reason but asking for one of them to explain that statement.
I am thankful for them proving us with all the data but that statement from Al puts a lot of doubt on the tune until him or Kyle D clears what could be a simple misunderstanding.
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kev This was said by Al earlier, which to me seems like he is advising people who run 91oct gas to skip his tune.
I am just asking for clarification on this, I am not bad-mouthing ZZP,being ungrateful for their hard work or in any way trying to pick a fight for no reason but asking for one of them to explain that statement.
I am thankful for them proving us with all the data but that statement from Al puts a lot of doubt on the tune until him or Kyle D clears what could be a simple misunderstanding.
the fact he followed it with the wink face implies that he was joking with me
At least thats how I took it
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the fact he followed it with the wink face implies that he was joking with me
At least thats how I took it
I took it as the usual statement from boosted people, "get boost, don't waste you time with NA mods".
Which is why I am asking for a clarification nothing more, if it was just a joke and nothing else then I'll apologize for being confused and move on.
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I had not realized that you guys were using 93 for the tune, in my opinion that is/was a mistake, you should have used 91 since that is what is available for most people, most of us staying NA do so for the simplicity vs turbo/SC "kinks".
Also here you guys say that someone using 91 should skip the tune, so is it safe to assume that you guys are not expecting the tune to be an improvement over stock when using 91?
The reason I ask is because we have "real world" proof that there is a big difference of a slingshot with a stock tune and one with Bob's tune and it doesn't require 93, again I am not talking about HP or wHP but improved driving response which is what most of us NA people care for.
Also I don't mean any offence but it's rather annoying to hear the "save your money for boost" comment on a dedicated NA thread, although thank you for being honest and saying it so we can figure out ahead of time if this tune is something that will do what we have come to expect from seeing people with "the other" tune.The reason we made the tune on 93 is because we do not have 91 octane anywhere around us. You are completely entitled to your opinion but it's just the fact of the matter. I cannot use what I do not have. It would be like you giving me an omelet and saying you made it with ostrich eggs and I told you, it's my opinion that is/was a mistake and you should've used chicken eggs because that's what is available to most people. But if you do not have chicken eggs available to you, how could make one with them?
Al also did say "it would really need to be done on a dyno. In reality, this was still at a fairly conservative level and I would not be surprised if it also ran well on 91. We were not at the knock limit of 93 with the final tune, and additional timing was not making significant changes signifying it was at/near MBT. That leads me to the conclusion that similar gains are probable on 91." With that said, the question is someone running 91 octane going to see an improvement in overall drive-ability? Absolutely. The power numbers should also be pretty close to 93. I think the tune on 91 is going to be an improvement over the stock tune definitely. While the raw power gains were not huge, from what I felt, it definitely woke the Slingshot up and it felt better over the entire power band, the mid range felt a lot stronger, and the SS was a lot more responsive overall.
What I think Al was really trying to say in regards to "people running 91 skipping the tune or saving your money for boost", is that the bang for the buck on a turbo kit is far higher than a NA setup and that's just the honest truth. Once you factor in the cost of the NA parts and a tune, you're right around half the cost of a turbo kit. But turbo kits aren't for everybody whether it is because of budget, or they just plain do not want to do it. Not all of us are out there running 1/2 miles with our Slingshots or roll racing on the highway pushing the SS well beyond what it was designed to do. But their inner child is screaming at them FASTER!! and there is a market for that, that we fill with our turbo kit. But there's also a huge market for the people that do not feel the need to do that. And adding the NA parts we offer and a tune that will make it how it should have been will fill those needs as well. So maybe the better bang for the buck is really a matter of perspective and what the individual is really looking to accomplish. Do the guys using their SS as a daily and/or just having fun and enjoying the Slingshot for what it is NEED a turbo kit? Absolutely not. For them, I believe it is more of a tool to get them out of their car and into the open air in an eye catching vehicle that they can spend time in and share with their significant other and friends. After driving the NA SS the other day, I can appreciate the NA builds and why people keep them that way. It's fun and quick around town and the power is very linear which would make it really fun and very predictable out on the twisty roads. You can still break the rear end loose and have a ton of fun in it. FunCycle even proved that you do not need to be boosted to be fast hanging with Bobby's white beast. I wouldn't take what Al said personally. I see your position but it wasn't meant to be an attack at the NA crowd.
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With my Slingshot as my daily driver I feel any mods I do have to be things that wont risk negatively impacting reliability this is one of the reasons why my mods so far have been suspension mods to improve handling and ride. As much as I would love the power of a turbo because of my usage staying NA seems like smart thing to do. As such this testing is very helpful to me. From what I have seen here I think there is a good chance the ZZP header / muffler system might be in my future - of the mods tested it seems to have provided the most substantial improvement and I also love the way it sounds. It also seems to be something that could be fairly easily reversed - Living in California we are not supposed to make any changes that remove smog control things like the cat. There are no inspections or tests at the moment, but with California you never know if that could change. As such being able to put it back stock long enough to pass a test might be important down the road. As to the tune, that would have to depend on pricing
Anyway I would like to thank both Al and Kyle one more time - the information you have given with this thread gives me a much better idea of where I can get the best bang from my mod money not only with the mods you sell, but also with the products offered by others as I feel fairly comfortable assuming your results would be very close to what I would get with the equivalent products they sell.
being mod money limited and needing to stay in the reliability box I now have a bit more of the education to do so wisely - - - - THANK YOU!!!!!!!
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Thanks Kyle D that answers my question , so when do you expect to start taking orders?
I am hoping to have everything ready to go on my end (website stuff and coordination with CBM) by late next week but I am going to try to make it happen sooner. The tune alone will be $350 and the Stage 1 NA Performance Package which will include our cold air intake, header and muffler exhaust package, and tune will be $1139.99. I will definitely keep you guys posted and make a new products release post when everything is ready.
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I am hoping to have everything ready to go on my end (website stuff and coordination with CBM) by late next week but I am going to try to make it happen sooner. The tune alone will be $350 and the Stage 1 NA Performance Package which will include our cold air intake, header and muffler exhaust package, and tune will be $1139.99. I will definitely keep you guys posted and make a new products release post when everything is ready.
makes me wonder if there will be a stage II
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makes me wonder if there will be a stage II
If we were to make a stage 2, it would be moving into 82# valve springs, a set of aggressive cams, and a tune update. I do have cams that would currently work but they are a little mild. Beyond that would be larger injectors, switching to E85, and another tune update. There, wouldn't be much left after that. This is all speculative though. It will all depend on sales of what we have for the NA currently and market demand for full on NA builds.
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I am hoping to have everything ready to go on my end (website stuff and coordination with CBM) by late next week but I am going to try to make it happen sooner. The tune alone will be $350 and the Stage 1 NA Performance Package which will include our cold air intake, header and muffler exhaust package, and tune will be $1139.99. I will definitely keep you guys posted and make a new products release post when everything is ready.
SO there's a deal , at $1139.99 if you buy the header and muffler at $599.99 and a $ 239.99 Cold Air Intake, you get the tune for $300.oo
The best priced , Header and performance exhaust, The best priced Cold Air Intake and now The best Priced Tune ! Thank you ZZP.
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Thanks for taking the time to educate us. The mods on my Sling were all completed before your existance was known. If I were to go down that path again....lets just say we would have talked.
I started with a header, an intake, exhuast, then a tune. It definatly was a improvement on how and when the torque band came on and the throttle became smooth as butter. I then discovered the ultimate rush from boost, that made me realize my initial investment was wasted. I would'nt change what I have now for anything short of a 400 HP Boxer powered AWD version.
Thanks agian.
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I would'nt change what I have now for anything short of a 400 HP Boxer powered AWD version.
Thanks agian.
Sign me up for one of those also!!!
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SO there's a deal , at $1139.99 if you buy the header and muffler at $599.99 and a $ 239.99 Cold Air Intake, you get the tune for $300.oo
The best priced , Header and performance exhaust, The best priced Cold Air Intake and now The best Priced Tune ! Thank you ZZP.
Well... since I already have a CAI on my 2019 SLR, I think all I need is the header/exhaust package and the tune - about $900. I think I can swing that, as long as I do it in two pieces. I hope to do header and exhaust this summer and the tune next winter when Ruby is in the garage and the down time won't be problematical.
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kev This was said by Al earlier, which to me seems like he is advising people who run 91oct gas to skip his tune.
I am just asking for clarification on this, I am not bad-mouthing ZZP,being ungrateful for their hard work or in any way trying to pick a fight for no reason but asking for one of them to explain that statement.
I am thankful for them proving us with all the data but that statement from Al puts a lot of doubt on the tune until him or Kyle D clears what could be a simple misunderstanding.
Sorry for the delayed response. What I meant was that the OEM calibration appears to be more than safe for running 91 fuel, and the limited power gains available from tuning make it not a very cost-effective power adder. But, the option is still there for someone who decides it's worth the cost to them.
We're not here to suck up every penny we can from every customer, we're here to actually help you guys and provide solid advice. I would feel like a crook if I sat here and tried to talk you into buying a tune for 91.the fact he followed it with the wink face implies that he was joking with me
At least thats how I took it
No jokes, I just love boost!
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Sorry for the delayed response. What I meant was that the OEM calibration appears to be more than safe for running 91 fuel, and the limited power gains available from tuning make it not a very cost-effective power adder. But, the option is still there for someone who decides it's worth the cost to them.
We're not here to suck up every penny we can from every customer, we're here to actually help you guys and provide solid advice. I would feel like a crook if I sat here and tried to talk you into buying a tune for 91.No jokes, I just love boost!
and you do sell the lowest cost option for Turbo charging, or at least the lowest cost that I would trust
