Okay Kyle D I am getting impatient - - - - - - - I need the numbers - - --- -
where oh where will my mod money go?
give me incentive
Header and exhaust if you lack those two... Then get tuned and be happy.
The Truth About Natural Power - A Look At What Makes Power and How Much
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Then get tuned and be happy.
I get tuned and happy most days. Hasn't changed my Slingshot performance though...
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Since this is a thread about the potential gain provided by things like a mod or a tune I am curious if you attach a dollar value or limit to what you expect to gain?
for example if a particular mod were going to potentially give you 5 more horsepower how much is a fair price for that gain (assuming there were no other benefits to the mod)?
It seems reasonable that there is a point where anyone would say it just isnt worth it, and I also expect that point is different for each of us so I am curious to know what people think
so do you require a minimum gain before you will invest or is any improvement enough to get your $$
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Since this is a thread about the potential gain provided by things like a mod or a tune I am curious if you attach a dollar value or limit to what you expect to gain?
for example if a particular mod were going to potentially give you 5 more horsepower how much is a fair price for that gain (assuming there were no other benefits to the mod)?
It seems reasonable that there is a point where anyone would say it just isnt worth it, and I also expect that point is different for each of us so I am curious to know what people think
so do you require a minimum gain before you will invest or is any improvement enough to get your $$
The Old Saying Is "How Fast Do You Want To Go" How Much Money Do You Have. They are now pushing 1,000 reliable HP on the street.
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Ok guys, here is all the data you've been waiting for. I will have some video of things tomorrow. Lets recap since there were a few posts between the original dyno sheet and now. I also want to reiterate that once we strapped it down to the dyno, at no point was the slingshot removed from the dyno, nor were any of the straps adjusted, and all of the pulls were done on the same day.
This first one is the initial base line pull. This SS produced 163whp and 165 ft-lb tq.
This should surprise the shit out of all of you. Putting in the catless DP we only picked up .2whp. and 1 ft-lb tq This tells us that the cat being used by Polaris is clearly not much of restriction.
Here is another shocker. I had the intake box from my 2015 SL laying around so just for shits and giggles I tossed it on to see how much better the SLR intake flowed than my old 2015 air box. The 2015 intake box made 2whp and 2ft-lb tq MORE than the stock SLR intake
Next up is the ZZP Intake still with the catless DP. Picked up 1whp and 1ft lb tq over over the 2015 air box coming in at 167whp and 168 ft-lb tq
Here is a comparison of all them together side by side with the catless DP and stock tune.
For our next comparison we kept the ZZP Intake on and swapped in our header and muffler package. We picked up 3whp and 5ft-lb tq
This last sheet will show the stock SLR intake with a catless DP vs my 2015 stock air box with a catless DP vs the ZZP Intake with ZZP header and muffler. So all in all you can see that from bone stock to adding an intake, header and muffler we only picked up about 6whp and 7ft-lb tq
Next up will be to add a tune to the ZZP Intake, header and muffler setup. I'm sure there will be gains but I, like you, should not expect them to be staggering. Hopefully this opens up everyone's eyes a little so you can see how much misinformation is out there. For example when you have companies like 1320 claiming 18hp gains from their header and muffler. Even if you called that crank hp and took out a high end estimate of 25% parasitic loss that would still be 14whp they are claiming. Clearly that is not happening. However, I would love to be proved wrong. I will gladly dyno a stock slingshot to get a base line number and swap out to the 1320 header and muffler that someone owns and do another pull all for free just in the name of science. Stay tuned....................
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Sounds like you need more virgins....
Thanks for the Data!
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Sounds like you need more virgins....
Thanks for the Data!
LMAO! Right?!?! No problem. I actually enjoyed doing all of this. Kept me out of the office for a full day. Looking forward to dinner and drinks with you guys in Maggie.
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LMAO! Right?!?! No problem. I actually enjoyed doing all of this. Kept me out of the office for a full day. Looking forward to dinner and drinks with you guys in Maggie.
Yep me too - but don't expect any Virgins
Just FYI - I have the Fab Factory intake and even though it is cool looking everyone with the same set up as mine running the stock intake manifold had better HP.
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Just FYI - I have the Fab Factory intake and even though it is cool looking everyone with the same set up as mine running the stock intake manifold had better HP.
Those do look cool but yeah I'm not surprised they did nothing. Especially on the 2.4. That's exactly why we never made a sheet metal intake for the Cobalts. They didn't do much if anything.
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Those do look cool but yeah I'm not surprised they did nothing. Especially on the 2.4. That's exactly why we never made a sheet metal intake for the Cobalts. They didn't do much if anything.
Well I am happy to have more HP than I really need and a cool looking intake... but to tell the truth it kills me knowing I could have a bunch more and $800 in my pocket. But if you don't try you will never know.
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Since this is a thread about the potential gain provided by things like a mod or a tune I am curious if you attach a dollar value or limit to what you expect to gain?
for example if a particular mod were going to potentially give you 5 more horsepower how much is a fair price for that gain (assuming there were no other benefits to the mod)?
It seems reasonable that there is a point where anyone would say it just isnt worth it, and I also expect that point is different for each of us so I am curious to know what people think
so do you require a minimum gain before you will invest or is any improvement enough to get your $$
I would like to see a 10% rear wheel HP gain - I kind of feel that anything less than that won't be noticeable behind the wheel. Ideally, I would like to hit the 210 - 225 rear wheel HP level.
The question for me isn't how many dollars for an increase in performance, but how much performance I can get before my very limited budget runs out.
As things stand now (and depending on data from Kyle D, I can see myself getting a header, cat-delete muffler, and then in a year or so, a tune. Next winter would be a good time for a tune as I don't drive Ruby much in December/January.
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Ideally, I would like to hit the 210 - 225 rear wheel HP level.
Getting to this level will require a turbo kit. We are currently at 170whp. The tune isn't going to add 30whp. MAYBE, if you also did a set of stage 2 cams we are developing and 82# valve springs in addition to what we have already done plus a tune you could hit 200whp on 93 octane. It would definitely be a full effort build at that point. But you'd also have $2100 into plus the cost of a tune which would put you within roughly $500 to the cost of one of my turbo kits which would put you at 265whp at 6psi on 93 octane. Bang for the buck, you cannot beat the turbo kit. Yes its a much larger initial investment and on a budget that can be hard and I completely get that. I'm just trying to put it all into perspective.
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LMAO! Right?!?! No problem. I actually enjoyed doing all of this. Kept me out of the office for a full day. Looking forward to dinner and drinks with you guys in Maggie.
Thanks for doing all of this. Now we have some real numbers for the HP increase with the mods added. Now when I added the cat delete and the Alpha CAI, HP I do not know but increased to 4 MPG to 34. (1,500 average 2 or 3 times) added the Welter dual and the tune the same day and dropped that same 4 mpg back down to the 30 mpg, this was also 1,500 mile average 2 or 3 times. Bob said that normally the tune get's a 4 mpg increase and does not understand what is going on. See you in Maggie and Thanks again for doing this. OH, and like MACAWS I changed the intake to the Hahn CAI and I call it the box. Never checked anything, but with the added Stickerdick Hot Rod fenders (parachute's) top end speed dropped 5 MPH on the straight away on the race track. From an easy 115 mph to a better get turn 9 perfect to get 110MPH
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I would like to see a 10% rear wheel HP gain - I kind of feel that anything less than that won't be noticeable behind the wheel. Ideally, I would like to hit the 210 - 225 rear wheel HP level.
The question for me isn't how many dollars for an increase in performance, but how much performance I can get before my very limited budget runs out.
As things stand now (and depending on data from Kyle D, I can see myself getting a header, cat-delete muffler, and then in a year or so, a tune. Next winter would be a good time for a tune as I don't drive Ruby much in December/January.
Save your money on the exhaust and just do the header and the cat delete with the stock muffler.
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Save your money on the exhaust and just do the header and the cat delete with the stock muffler.
Thanks for the recommendations...
I'm waiting to see what Kyle's data shows. His header/muffler combo gets rid of both cats, and the price for the pair seems quite reasonable.
Like others, I'm hooked by the teaser he gave and anxious to see how the numbers come out.
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thank you for all the work and also for all of this information. I was hoping the cat delete would provide a bigger improvement. knowing these numbers it would seem it would be much smarter to do your header and muffler system - - - it will be interesting to see how much the tune adds
Thanks again - - - having this kind of information is gold for someone like me on a very limited mod budget
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Thanks Kyle D for the numbers,I just like to remind people that the sound and low end response that a CAI/exhaust provide make them worth the investment regardless of how little hp they increase.
To be honest if you care about hp numbers at all then NA tuning is not for you because the bang for your buck is horrible.
In the darkside there is a build thread that Henry started(3+years ago) for someone named sopranos fan in which they went all in with NA tuning,ported throttle body,valve kit etc and the whole thing got like 30 hp if I remember right however the owner said that by the time it was all said and done he was over 5k deep which was the price of Henry's turbo (100+ hp) back then.
