wow , it,s one thing for a guy to decide to sell rear plates of similar design but different shape, form, materials , (carbon fiber look ) different mounting systems , but when he actually buys yours SlingLow under false pretenses obviously just to use it as his template as he is too lazy or incompetent to take his own measurements , then to even use a photo of one of yours in his product adds ! that is not only totally deceptive but it makes me think the guy doesn't even own a damn Slingshot . If he did he would have simply measured his own rear deck measurements ,, a template can be made with a simple piece of bristol board from the dollar store instead of paying for one to just take measurements off. Tells me the scumbag doesn,t even own a Slingshot ! Has that rear windscreen ever even been fitted or passed any sort of road worthiness testing , let alone high speed ? I doubt its ever been on a Slingshot !
Slingspeed.com Products ?
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Well, at the end of the day, if your volume and profits are too low to pursue patent protection, you are vulnerable to this type of knock-off. It's really not avoidable and you never know who might reproduce your product. With regard to the rear plate it is really of simple design and construction and I'm not sure if a patent would be attainable, and if so, if it could be easily defeated by a simple change of a single element. I do admire Ruptured Duck at MeanSling for his diligence in protecting his products and ideas, but they are more sophisticated than what I am doing, and I haven't yet made the decision to step up to his level. However, the emergence of SOG, and it's intended support of forum vendors, may be the nudge I need to 'go legit'.
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...may be the nudge I need to 'go legit'.
You've not been legit for decades....isn't it a little late to be turning over a new leaf?
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Well, at the end of the day, if your volume and profits are too low to pursue patent protection, you are vulnerable to this type of knock-off. It's really not avoidable and you never know who might reproduce your product. With regard to the rear plate it is really of simple design and construction and I'm not sure if a patent would be attainable, and if so, if it could be easily defeated by a simple change of a single element. I do admire Ruptured Duck at MeanSling for his diligence in protecting his products and ideas, but they are more sophisticated than what I am doing, and I haven't yet made the decision to step up to his level. However, the emergence of SOG, and it's intended support of forum vendors, may be the nudge I need to 'go legit'.
You can always file for patents on your own but truth be told a patent only has value if you can afford to defend it. It is just a case of your expected profit VS cost of legal fees.
But you have a major advantage and that is the people on this forum and SOG who will support you first. I will bet that you will see a post shortly from someone who had the cheap imitation rear plate fall off because of the lack of tested mounting with tape.
My money is on your success...but I am bias because "You are Family"
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You've not been legit for decades....isn't it a little late to be turning over a new leaf?
What I mean by legit is to get a business license and operate above board by paying taxes and......aw shit! Never mind!
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I will bet that you will see a post shortly from someone who had the cheap imitation rear plate fall off because of the lack of tested mounting with tape.
I hope not for two reasons. I'd hate to see someone get injured and I hope they don't sell any.
My money is on your success...but I am bias because "You are Family"
Man, that really means a lot to me. Coming from you those words carry a lot of weight. Thank you sir!
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Patents are not cheap. I'm lucky having done quite a few over the years for other companies. I can get 90% there including the renderings. Do have to pay for assistance past that. In my case it does make sense from a cost standpoint. You have to pick an choose wisely as to what you patent and how. I am almost complete with the sport top but wonder if a design would have been better than a utility patent. As we have seen with several products from various people a visual difference can be lacking. A design patent is a little easier for those visual type products but generally speaking they must have a design element applied to it that can be argued and shown to be distinctive. Just contacted our attorney (day job) about a knock off product already being made based off a prototype I showed at SEMA. We filed a design patent prior to the show for just this reason. It will be 12-18 months before we will be able to go after the guy. Can't do anything until your patent is in place.
It is all about the $ (roi) as MACAWS noted. One benefit would be company value at a later date. IP can add substantial value over one that does not have any.
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What I mean by legit is to get a business license and operate above board by paying taxes and......aw shit! Never mind!
Don't worry about it. Donald has been doing it for years!!!
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Hold up... taxes... what's that.
And how do I avoid it. -
Did a little digging and it appears we were contacted back in June about some MeanSling bags. Guess it was good we were out of stock...
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Yes I too have been involved with a few companies and patents but its not all that it is cracked up to be , and very rarely unless your talking an item that is expected to do many millions of dollars a year in sales and as Patrick says has great IP value is it worthwhile . When you are in the patent pending stage of a product that is say worth $200.00 retail and you find somebody else is now producing a copy which would violate your patent if you are successful in being awarded one, the only damages you can suit him for are the licensing or royalty fees he should have paid you for using your new technology if indeed it is someday awarded a patent. And you can only suit for those licensing fees from the day you legally notified him that you believe he is violating your pending patent . That legal notification must include a complete disclosure of your pending patent application . including all your Claims and designs etc. so now you,ve had to disclose any technological information you may have had that you were trying to keep secret until such time as your patent is awarded.
SAY you do properly serve somebody and after they have their experts review your full pending application, they decide your application will never be approved and awarded a patent, as most aren't, and they just continue manufacturing anyway, what now ? Well now, if and when your patent is awarded you must expense a lawsuit against him, and the most monetary settlement you stand to be awarded is the amount you can convince the judge, he should have been paying you in licensing fees for using your technologies from notification date to current. So back to the value of this lawsuit , is it worth it ? IF YOR PATENT IS ON A $200.00 ITEM which costs say $160.00 each to manufacture, distribute, advertise and sell, there is only $40.00 gross profit per unit that you will have to prove a percentage of which could have went to licensing fees, most industrial manufacturing licensing fees run about 4% of gross sale value .So you have to convince a judge he should have been paying $8.00 out of the $40.00 profit in licensing fees as that is that industry standard licensing fee, which you , by the way are charged with the burden of proving, he of course will argue it should only be 2% .
So in the end, if a guy is selling 100 a year $200.00 items that you were able to get a patent approved on , the most your going to be able to suit him for, if you are able to convince the judge it should have been a 4% licensing fee is $800.00 dollars a year for the for the few years it took for your patent to get awarded and you to get him into court after legally having notified him and establishing your claim. So unless the guy is selling many , many thousands of these a year , the legal fees to suit him, for the licensing fees he should have been paying you for your ideas, will far out weigh the petty licensing fees it may be proven he owes you..
HENCE like I said, more often than not, a patent is not all its cracked up to be. You cannot suit him for the profits he made off of manufacturing your item , but only your losses you incurred when he did not pay you the industry standard licensing fee he should have been paying you.
You can also attempt to get damages for loss profits but the burden of proof is on you that you sold 200 lees of your items because he sold 200 , in reality you can only prove that if you can prove to a judge there were only 200 possible customers in the world and he took them all therefore you had no chance to make profit on your own sales. As this is never the case, almost never are loss profits awarded in a patent infringement case.
Yes if a judge believes he intentionally knew you had a application that he knew you would be awarded on , and ignored your notice and manufactured anyway , the judge could choose to make an example of him and award you enhanced damages , but the most they can be is three times the licensing fees he should have paid you , so still peanuts unless he sold thousands of items and rarely are enhanced damages awarded because again you have to prove he absolutely knew and believed your application, he ignored , would be awarded. and that is never the case as most applications fail to receive a patent for one reason or another, usually because the patent office discovers the patent is not for NEW technology as you cannot patent prior art. so again rarely are you awarded enhanced damages .
About the only thing you might justify the legal fees of suing on, is that the judge may award you an injunction preventing him from manufacturing your item for a predetermined amount of time . But again in most situations unless your patent is worth millions , the legal costs you must pay to obtain that just isn't worth it .
So like I said, patents on items that aren't worth millions, aren't all they are cracked up to be . However, there is a whole blood sucking leaches industry of lawyers who will gladly tell you all day long that a patent is the end all and be all and will gladly get you one for a mere ten thousand dollars today !
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There are differences regarding infringement cost associated with design and utility patents. They are not the same.
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At least the knock off copy is a shit product and more expensive than the real thing. I for one have no problem pointing that out anywhere I can.
Supporting my brother from another mutha.
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What a fraud and steeler .
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There are difference regarding infringement cost associated with design and utility patents. They are not the same.
What a fraud and steeler .
Actually these items are available on Alibaba. This one and several other products. If willing to buy the quantities they will sell them to you. Sad but the overseas market is a strong indicator to the SS accessories business. There was a bump about 1-2 years in as the first accessories came out. The market is just not big enough just yet so very little has been being copied recently. Doesn't mean it want pick back up.
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Glen D how did you hear about the website and parts?
I saw the item on eBay and it contained a link to the website. I figured the product was actually the one our member produces till I saw it was attached only with tape
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Not gonna lie ..... I had to look up Caveat Emptor, as i am sure a few others had too as well.
That's when Hirohito needs a tooth filling
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talk about a generic website! If you can't put effort or money into your website chances are the product they offer will be the same. No thanks!
