While Kev's post makes sense, I just tried Googling US FMVSS motorcycle GVWR w/o any decent results. I can see how the math for Slingshot weight and 450 lbs for passenger/accessories add up, you'd think that finding the relevant legal standard wouldn't be that difficult.
Motorcycle classification weight
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So anything you add like my roof, just made my SS illegal to operate. No different than an overloaded semi. Good thing they don’t use scales when doing a safety inspection.
We are mixing apples and oranges. In this thread the topic has been what is the maximum manufactured weight the SlingShot can be and still be legally considered a motorcycle, which has little to do with its load carrying capability. Like most vehicles there is a given maximum gross weight which can be found in your Owners Manual, for the 2015 SlingShot it can be found on pages 14 and 84.
Bill
Added note: I got brash and emailed Polaris where I promptly received the following response:
"Good morning William,
Thank you for contacting Polaris. There are federal regulations that we have to follow to ensure the slingshot will be categorized as a motorcycle. One of the regulations is the weight of the vehicle but we have some additional regulations including stopping distance as well for example. Please let me know if you have any other questions or if there is anything else I can do to assist. I can be reached at 1-800-765-2747 or by replying directly to this email. You may receive a brief survey at this email address inquiring about my service levels with regards to your concerns. If you wouldn’t mind completing it, I would very much appreciate your feedback.
Respectfully,
Stephen| Case Manager
2100 HWY 55 | Medina, MN 55340
CS.resolution@polaris.com | P: 1800-765-2747 | polaris.com" -
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Well if you study the standards and acts in detail you will see they only have to be less than 2200 lbs gvwr. that's why coincidentally they are 2199 and Polaris has told you time and time again they are at the Max. However @BKL it's not as simple as looking at the FMVSS the guide to those affecting motorcycle maufactures above when you find the standards, they are only a generic paragraph description, you need to purchase the full text versions of that publication at a few hundred dollars. But there is government site where all U.S.laws regs, etc must be publicly published in full text called the federal register I linked above . But you will need days to learn how to navigate that bitch, use advanced search options to narrow your search but even they are almost useless. So why not just trust polaris when they tell you and I have confirmed in the Canadian gov links posted above, the certification requirements are for gvwr and gross axle weights. People have to stop imagining there is an empty weight certification requirement . It simply is not so . Polaris needs to stay about 1750 curb weight so they will still have 40 lbs belly fat room for guys who actually weigh over the standard which is 175 lbs for each seat. Stop panicking this is the same. with all motorcycle manufacturers . Buy a loaded road glide Harley fill it full of options bags etc and you will be over gvwr when you put two passengers on at 250 each. And what I say by stop panicking @big dog, operating a passenger vehicle over gvwr is not illegal .it's just a liability you assume when you do so. ONLY commercial operators (truck drivers ) are bound by law to calculate their axle weights and that they are in accordance with those and gvwr before each load leaves the yard. Those are log book requirements and are legally required by state laws prior to each load hauled and it can be done because every load of freight has to have weight on bill of laden. because state laws require any person operating a commercial vehicke to calculate these daily it is illegal for them to operate a transport truck above gvwr of axle weight. There is no state law I know of that says little old harriet down the street who only drives to church on sundays must weigh her grocery bags individually and stack of bibles before she heads home on sundays. To say it is illegal to operate a slingshot over gvwr simply is not so untill your state passes legislatuon requiring little old harriet to perform gvwr calculations before each mornings drive to make sure she isnt overloading her 1985 three cylinder grocery getter. It simply is not practical for regulators to require harriet to know the individual weight of her nine grocery bags .So no law exist that says every operator of a passenger vehicle or motorcycle must know her gvwr and perform calculations daily to make sure she is never exceeding them. It may not technically be right to operate a slingshot over the gvwr but until such time as a law comes into place requiring you to calculate your loaded axle weights And gvwr daily prior to leaving the yard as truck drivers are required to do, you are not breaking any law when you and little old harriet drive your passenger vehiclea without doing so. So adding options and operating a slinshot at a higher gvwr is NOT ILLEGAL. just know you will not be able to blame Polaris for the fact it takes longer to stop when heavily loaded and drive accordingly. Don't you see, as in Polaris email response to @BKL above they are telling you there are gvwr they certified too, but they, nor Harley Davidson nor Uhaul are ever going to go to press promoting that their vehicles can be easily overloaded, its bad for sales and theres no law requiring them to do so. Every single uhaul truck on the road can be loaded over axle weight and gvwr if loaded heavily and in that case and only that case , not passenger vehicle operators, a non commercial driver can be fined for exceeding the weights allowed on their commercial truck but only because the appropriate State laws say every operator of a commercial vehicle must not exceed these. Slingshot operator's loaded with options and two people exceeding the individual axle weights or gvwr cannot be fined for doing so as the states do not mandate that little old harriet weigh her grocery bags daily . And untill they do Harriet and slinshotters are not breaking any law operating over theae weights. Stop the panick train. PLEASE some of us supposedly criminally minded aftermarket manufacturers still need to make a living ! lol
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I see several issues involved here.
Laws should be openly available for folks to access and understand without requiring extensive research. I guess I just (naively/stupidly) expected the Federal Register to be easily accessible to the average American or anybody else for that matter so that a simple Google search would find what I was looking for. As a publicly accessible site, the Federal Register website should be freely searchable and index-able by search engines and should not prohibit such data mining since the end result is a better-informed public.
Unless the Federal Register website has explicit anti-harvest code to prevent Google or another search engine from indexing the site, I'd expect any search engine to be able to find it.
I would expect a search for maximum permissible or legal weight limit to include references to GVWR simply because the GVWR IS the maximum permissible/legally designed weight for a given vehicle. Of course, anyone could overload the vehicle, but the vehicle had to be designed for a certain maximum weight as part of the design process. Laws should NOT be so obtusely worded that extensive legal research is required to find something as simple as a GVWR.
Thanks to the efforts of those folks who have contributed to this thread, I at least now have a satisfactory/plausible explanation for Polaris' apparent design decisions. Of course, some folks would still consider the Slingshot to be relatively heavy compared to the new Vanderhall Venice, for example.
I still feel the Slingshot offers a decent level of value and performance and, from the reports I've seen on crash damage and injuries, a reasonable amount of safety, for its cost. -
What testing did Polaris have to go through for brakes
Display MoreI see several issues involved here.
Laws should be openly available for folks to access and understand without requiring extensive research. I guess I just (naively/stupidly) expected the Federal Register to be easily accessible to the average American or anybody else for that matter so that a simple Google search would find what I was looking for. As a publicly accessible site, the Federal Register website should be freely searchable and index-able by search engines and should not prohibit such data mining since the end result is a better-informed public.
Unless the Federal Register website has explicit anti-harvest code to prevent Google or another search engine from indexing the site, I'd expect any search engine to be able to find it.
I would expect a search for maximum permissible or legal weight limit to include references to GVWR simply because the GVWR IS the maximum permissible/legally designed weight for a given vehicle. Of course, anyone could overload the vehicle, but the vehicle had to be designed for a certain maximum weight as part of the design process. Laws should NOT be so obtusely worded that extensive legal research is required to find something as simple as a GVWR.
Thanks to the efforts of those folks who have contributed to this thread, I at least now have a satisfactory/plausible explanation for Polaris' apparent design decisions. Of course, some folks would still consider the Slingshot to be relatively heavy compared to the new Vanderhall Venice, for example.
I still feel the Slingshot offers a decent level of value and performance and, from the reports I've seen on crash damage and injuries, a reasonable amount of safety, for its cost.Ok Bkl I.ll help you out, here is only a sample but its the interesting section ,
What does FMVSSS standard #122 motorcycle brake systems say, here is the link for the actual seven pages of text for that standard, outlining braking systems required and required tests Keep in mind its the actual legal lanqage so not near as informative as the 117 page guide for that testing I will also link below
CFR-2011-title49-vol6-sec571-122.pdfMuch more interesting to read is this NHTSA 117 page document actually explaining all the tests a manufacturer must perform to certify compliance with braking standard #122 of FMVSS. wet tests, high speed test, fade tests , burnishing tests etc This is what Polaris had to do and submit in order to be in compliance , the type of motorcycle the Slingshot is classified as in this document is a three wheeled motorcycle category 3-5. You will see they did have to state their GVWR and GFAW and GRAW that they were certifying to . AND you will see it is very rigorous, detailed, and with a number of tests The Slingshot met.
tp-122-03.pdf -
Its such an interesting read I think Im going to give it its own thread, I think a lot more people, than reading this thread would be curious to know what kind of testing Polaris had to do to certify compliance for the Slingshot,s brakes
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kev, I'm not arguing against anything you've posted. I'm just complaining that governments should make info on all laws easily accessible and easily understandable. For example, the bottom line for GVWR should simply state the maximum design weight of a vehicle including passengers, fluids and any cargo. Then the government website can post all of the various conditions used to make that determination...
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kev, I'm not arguing against anything you've posted. I'm just complaining that governments should make info on all laws easily accessible and easily understandable. For example, the bottom line for GVWR should simply state the maximum design weight of a vehicle including passengers, fluids and any cargo. Then the government website can post all of the various conditions used to make that determination...
We are talking about the government. When have they ever made anything easy to understand or find the info we need?!
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kev, I'm not arguing against anything you've posted. I'm just complaining that governments should make info on all laws easily accessible and easily understandable. For example, the bottom line for GVWR should simply state the maximum design weight of a vehicle including passengers, fluids and any cargo. Then the government website can post all of the various conditions used to make that determination...
Absolutely, I couldn,t agree more it shouldn,t be near as difficult to find this info , Just hoping Im helping ,Eh ? ( this ones for you bud @KayTwo)
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Its such an interesting read I think Im going to give it its own thread, I think a lot more people, than reading this thread would be curious to know what kind of testing Polaris had to do to certify compliance for the Slingshot,s brakes
Im even going to post it on TDS ! lmao
BOOO, TRAITOR , FRICKIN CANADIAN EH?
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Regarding this entire topic:
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Ok Ok I get it but it is getting comical and kinda fun lol
