School Shootings

Quote from Bill Martin

First off prayers and condolences to all victims and their families in this horrible Florida shooting that has claimed 17 lives so far.

I know many of us here are older from a different generation but WTF is going on with our young people today??? I know school shootings (other than the sniper at University of Texas) were unheard of when I was growing up. Have we as a society allowed things to devolve so far that young folks have no respect for human life??? These crazies seem to pick on school and church settings because they know most there will be unarmed and just shooting fish in a barrel turning places that should be the most peaceful into killing fields. I know there was a gun scare at a local high school a couple weeks ago and I truly feared for my grandaughter’s life for a short while. Luckily it was just a stupid kid bringing a gun to school to show it to his friends. We all know gun control is not the answer. Do we increase school taxes enough to pay to have armed guards roam the halls of our schools? At this point I know it sounds crazy but I am just about ready to see my 15 year old granddaughter armed so she would at least have a chance in one of these horrific events. I know that never would happen and would cause many other problems. So what is the answer?? I hate to say it just seems we just have to accept the slaughter of our children and grandchildren. Truly a sad day when things like this cannot be stopped as it appears to me.

The best thing that you or all of us to do is train our kids (MINORS) on how to handle hand guns and rifles. The need being if they were ever in this type of situation and a gun were available they would not be scared to handle it or worst case use it. They may not be able to carry but they would know how to safely handle guns and know when to use it, if one happened to be available.

.

Read up about this kid .... IMO this was telegraphed and preventable ......

Beyond that ......

Closed campuses ......

Even in the 80's if you wanted to visit my HS you had to go through the office and sign in, same with if a student wanted to leave during school hours .... the grounds where (high) fenced and all doors leading to the outside in un-fenced areas other than the main office entrances only opened out ....we also had security even way back then ....

It didn't look or feel like a prison as some current day parents claim it would be because it was designed from the start to be secure but not confining and was our normal ..... open campuses where students can come and go as they please and anyone is able to walk in from the street just don't make sense to me ...

.....

I agree Orangeman,but there is no 100 percent solution for any senerio.

I'm not going to argue gun control (although I have a different opinion I'm sure), but the reality is that gun control WONT help in these cases as I don't know any school shooting where the kid was taking assault weapons into a school with thousands of rounds of ammunition... has there been? I've missed it if there was. When we were kids, it was knives. I had a 9th grade student pull a knife on me and I put him threw a closet door and made sure he knew what would happen if he did it again. I call it dealing with an issue and making sure it doesn't happen again. Today, kids don't know how to "deal" and the sense of entitlement THAT HAS BEEN PASSED DOWN FROM "OUR" GENERATION in my opinion is unacceptable. I can't believe how many of my kids friends don't even do chores or help around the house all while having and running around with iPhone X phones. I hear the teachers in the schools complaining about the kindergarteners running around with their iPads. It's just my opinion, but it's "our" fault the kids are the way they are. I HATE that our kids don't "lose" and everyone has to be a winner. How do the kids "deal" with failure? I have guns in the house and the kids have all fired them, but they also all know I'd skin them alive if they touched them without me handing the gun to them. That's if they could get in the safe in the first place. Our kids have become spoiled entitled brats that can't deal with reality. ... and in my opinion, that is why all this has been happening. It's sad, but I do believe it's because of our generation raising a lot of wusses.

I can't imagine being a parent with a child in one of these schools. My hart goes out to these parents. I can't even comprehend or start to imagine what it's like to loose one of my kids. Hopefully I never will. God willing!

Our country has condoned the "you can say anything and do anything" for far too long. Too many have been raised with no moral compass. No- it's not violent video games- Hundreds of thousands have played and do play- and still do not act out violence. Gun control? Oh, hell no! Hundreds of thousands of us have weapons and would never turn them on another human being, unless in self defense or defense of others.
We live in a society where celebrities have no boundaries- think Gifford carrying the head. (BTW- Obama's wife's artist who did portrait for Smithsonian is apparently famous for pictures like that.....and that's supposed to be art) When tragedy hits someone- people publicly say- wish it had happened to all. (Think Steve Scalise shooting- "1 down, 215 to go"). Protesting isn't meaningful enough unless we destroy other people's property. (Think Berkeley and hundreds of other sites)
Our country has created an atmosphere where way too many want to claim that they are victims- racism, sexism, discrimination-- others feel sorry for you, and you have a reason not to pick yourself up, and make something out of your life. Anything that hurts your feelings must be removed - think Confederate statues. When the hell did that become the norm?
I am not discounting some mental health issues, but do not believe that the entire country is suffering from a chemical or neurological imbalance that would cause this. IMHO, the root cause for much of it- Not all, as there will always be deviants, it is extreme liberalism. Kids are all winners- Well, guess what- that is not life, and when someday the kid hits the real world, and has issues, or fails- they lose it, and act out, meaning any retaliation is acceptable.
Raising my kid, I made sure that he had to opportunity fail- (Oh, elementary teacher- give him a yellow card for less than stellar behavior!) He learned that actions have consequences. Apparently- today, there are few...... (IRS & Lois Lerner, HRC.) When he got older, he was ready & able to deal with real life setbacks.
There is probably not one person on this forum who has not had their fair share of "Life Sucks" handed to them. (If there is- don't sweat it- there are plenty of us who got extra helpings to make up for it). Yet- even with all our shortcomings- we do not have mass murderers on board. The vast majority of us- well, we come up with Plan B. Too many today don't even have a decent Plan A.

Off soap box, as rant could continue. My hope and prayer is that this pendulum has swung as far left as it can, before it begins its descent. If not, this country will not survive as we know it

I've been keeping my eye on this. Tech has been around for a while...
Smart guns: could fingerprint technology solve America's shooting deaths? | US news | The Guardian

and I'm SURE it can be bypassed and such and it wouldn't be full proof, but I do believe in these school shootings that it would stop them. I'm also all for if a parent gives their kid access to the gun (full time... assuming there is a way to temporarily disable say if you are teaching your child how to shoot), that any parent who bypasses the system and provides the gun for the child (under a certain age), that the parent should be responsible for what the kid does with the gun. MUST be some personal responsibility involved in this.

IMHO sometime in the late 70s and early 80s many parents stopped parenting and counted on schools to educate and bring their children up - not what teachers are paid to do or can do

I can go on and on how parenting children has disappeared and how I think that has spiralled into a good part of the mess we have today

I must have been too busy with work today because I didn't hear anything about this until now. I am sick of hearing about all this shit. How is being a child so difficult today that they think this is the answer? I know it would cost a shit ton of money, but I also know a shit ton of Marines that would love the opportunity to protect these kids. Obviously these events can't fully be prevented, but they can sure as hell can be stopped quicker with a couple well trained Marines...or any veteran (sorry, I am bias) roaming the halls.

O', this isn't a quick fix. And people have to stop looking at EVERYTHING as an assault on guns and the government trying to control things. We can't have it both ways. I'll restrict the use of the gun to my wife and I to keep the gun out of the hands of someone else any day of the week. I'm sure there will be someone willing to come up with money to retrofit what is out there. Problem is, people have to acknowledge that the problem needs to be fixed and do something about it. People have to stop just throwing their hands up and saying the liberals are to blame and they aren't going to do it. We can't live in the old and think it's going to change by itself or go back to the way it was. Ignorance is not the solution. Something has to be done, but how many kids have to die before it happens. I don't agree with mental screening or monitoring people's mental health with some sort of registry. THAT would be too far... There are solutions, but people need to want to change.

Quote from Ross

IMHO sometime in the late 70s and early 80s many parents stopped parenting and counted on schools to educate and bring their children up - not what teachers are paid to do or can do

I can go on and on how parenting children has disappeared and how I think that has spiralled into a good part of the mess we have today

My daughter's school once told us that we were being to hard on her and she was too stressed out and borderline depressed... what? Because we were MAKING her do her homework and required that if she got a grade less than 70, that she go in and talk to her teacher after school. This kid had a 64 in math once and she turned it around to a 94 within a month. I looked at them and asked them if they were going to go and interview for her at her job and what if she actually doesn't get the job... are they going to do her reports for her when she gets the job or is she going to do it herself and make sure things her boss asks her to do are done correctly. I was just blown away that we were being too strict with her. I mean... when I screwed up, I got a belt across my ass. We weren't doing that, but for damn sure she was going to do her part and be responsible for her side of things. She can feel good about her accomplishments afterwards.

There's a lot of countries with gun control who don't have problems to this degree. But since you don't like gun control, the alternative is this:

If we are choosing up sides here put me on the side that an armed society is a polite society. We need more guns not less guns. Every teacher, every adult within the schools system needs to be trained and armed to protect the children left within their care up to and including deadly force. If the scumbags that are doing this crap knew they would have to face someone armed they would not be doing it. You see that as soon as this pos encountered someone else who was armed he threw his hands up and gave up without a fight. I am sick and tired of turning the other cheek. We need to put a stop to this crap and stop looking for the govt to do it for us. A govt big enough to give you everything you want is big enough to take everything you have. More guns in the hands of good people is the only answer period. The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun so "gun up".

I thank God that my parents loved me enough to punish me when i knowingly did wrong, had high expectations of me, taught me the value of hard work, to me to give respect whether earned or not, didn't reward me for pedestrian results, and never wanted to be my best friend more than my parent/mentor/coach

Quote from Ghost

If we are choosing up sides here put me on the side that an armed society is a polite society. We need more guns not less guns. Every teacher, every adult within the schools system needs to be trained and armed to protect the children left within their care up to and including deadly force. If the scumbags that are doing this crap knew they would have to face someone armed they would not be doing it. You see that as soon as this pos encountered someone else who was armed he threw his hands up and gave up without a fight. I am sick and tired of turning the other cheek. We need to put a stop to this crap and stop looking for the govt to do it for us. A govt big enough to give you everything you want is big enough to take everything you have. More guns in the hands of good people is the only answer period. The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun so "gun up".

And some people can't seem to understand why the "gun free safe zones" have such a high crime rate.

Quote from Bill Martin

I’m sure this crew can remember “wait til your father gets home” or “go outside and cut a switch for yourself” (knowing it better not be too small) for just about any infraction. FEAR - IT WORKED!! I can still remember sneaking a slingshot (the old kind) to school and the coach whipped my ass, then my mom when I got home got a piece, then finally my dad when he got home. After that I didn’t even want to see a slingshot-let alone bring one to school. There is a big difference IMO between a good old fashioned ass whippin and child abuse. I’d bet the majority of us got taken to the woodshed a time or two and we all made out pretty good I think. Time to go old school on today’s youth !!!

I had someone once tell me that a kid shouldn't fear their parent. I raised the bullshit flag on that one. I feared my parents which made me respect my parents which in turn made me a decent member of society. I'm not saying that a child should fear their parents for non-legitimate reasons (being abused), but damn...these kids today don't fear or respect a damn thing.

Can't agree more @Ross. @Ghost... I hear you, but I also know the teachers in this school district. I wouldn't trust some of them with pointing a carrot at something let alone a gun even WITH training. The teachers can't teach let alone protect my child without shooting themselves in the foot.