Hybrid Turbos?

  • By James Parker Yesterday at 11:27pm



    Renault motorsport
    Renault’s KERS engine uses an electric motor to spin up the turbo, unlocking serious low-end power. Would a similar system work on a motorcycle?
    After I worked on the chassis design for the Mission R electric bike, I decided to look at the possibility of a “hybrid” motorcycle. Most hybrid vehicles have two drive systems—internal combustion and electric—and on motorcycles this imposes serious weight and packaging compromises. At this point, I don’t think conventional hybrid motorcycles would be very good.
    But there’s another hybrid technology under development that could work well to create very interesting high-performance motorcycles. Starting in 2009, Formula 1 car racing allowed a hybrid system that provided supplemental horsepower, called KERS (Kinetic Energy Recovery System). Electrical (or mechanical) energy generated under braking is stored and then used to provide additional power under acceleration for short periods.
    In 2014, a second hybrid element was introduced. In addition to the KERS motor/generator, there is now a second motor/generator, this one attached to the engine’s turbocharger. Under deceleration, when reduced exhaust flow reduces turbo speed, this motor spins up to maintain turbo rpm and keep boost near maximum. Turbo lag, the time needed for turbos to speed up enough to provide boost, has always been the turbo’s weak point. The new hybrid application virtually eliminates it.
    At high engine and turbo revs, the electric motor attached to the turbo becomes a generator, generating electricity while working to slow the turbo and thus limit boost from becoming destructive to the engine. (A conventional wastegate is also used as a backup.) The electricity charges the battery for when the motor needs to keep the turbo’s speed up (or to help with the KERS energy distribution).


    The illustration shows the Renault F1 battery (left), engine (center), and turbo (right). Nested in the engine’s vee is the turbo’s motor/generator, called the MGU-H by Renault.
    Will we see such a system on motorcycles soon? Probably not, as the F1 setup is astronomically expensive. But there’s another version, using parallel ideas, that’s closer to production—the Volvo High Performance Drive-E Concept.
    This engine is a 2-liter inline-four, with two small, conventional, exhaust-driven turbos mounted close to the exhaust ports for best efficiency. There’s also a third turbo (or at least the compressor half), but this one is exclusively electrically driven to eliminate turbo lag when the engine is at low revs and the exhaust-driven turbos would not be providing enough boost.
    How well does it work? It makes 450 hp from 2 liters and has the bottom-end torque it needs to pull a heavy car around. What would something like this look like in, say, a Yamaha FZ-07? Although its engine is less than half the displacement of the Volvo project, mechanically it’s much like half of the Volvo with its two cylinders, two cams, and four valves per cylinder. It would get one small exhaust-driven turbo and a smaller version of the Volvo electrically driven turbo. Add an intercooler and various upgrades to take the additional power and we’d have a little superbike.
    At the power-per-displacement number of the Volvo, the little 689cc “FZE-07” would put out 155 hp and would likely have significantly more bottom-end torque than any literbike.
    The lesson here is that this alternative hybrid technology can liberate turbocharging from its dependence on exhaust flow and engine rpm and do for bottom-end power what turbocharging has always done for top-end power. We can perhaps see the super-efficient F1 approach to hybrid turbocharging as the preferred future system, but Volvo has shown that we don’t have to wait to take that approach—we can have a workable system now.
    Audi is also working with turbo company Valeo on what they call an electric supercharger. With Audi’s involvement with Ducati, would that be a possible route to seeing hybrid turbos on motorcycles? Interesting times ahead.


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  • I've been following electric superchargers for several years. Not the junk that can be found on EBay where someone is selling an electric bilge blower as a "supercharger".
    For several years now, two companies/guys have been offering custom-built systems that use an electric motor to power a turbocharger and produce approximately 4 psi boost. Thomas Knight (Boosthead.com) offers electric superchargers for several different motors. The other guy, YouTube username Robftss, (New site - HOME), has also offered systems focused on the FRS/BRZ for several engines for several years. These systems are designed for on-demand use for 15 seconds+/- of boost, following which the batteries can be recharged for the next use. From a battery setup point of view, Robftss seems to offer a more integrated system that is designed for recharging the battery system. Thomas Knight's offerings seem to offer a little more output, but don't seem to have the more extensive battery design offered by Robftss.
    The Phantom Superchargers website links to reviews by Wild Weasel*, who has long debunked electric supercharger claims and tested Robftss' design on his personal vehicle, a turbo'd BMW, IIRC. I remembered incorrectly. I just checked Wild Weasel's site and he tested the electric supercharger using a Sunfire with an M45 supercharger.
    I've no personal experience with either approach, but both seem to have some interesting ideas. If I could afford to spend a couple Grand on an experiment, I think it would be interesting to see what happens. * Just checked and Wild Weasel's site was not available. I hope this is just a temporary problem. Wild Weasel's site was back when I checked Thursday night a little before Midnight Central Time.

    Edited 4 times, last by BKL ().

  • If you read Wild Weasel's reporting about his tests of the two different systems Robftss sent him for testing, he comments "I also tested both blowers with my M45 supercharger running in tandem, and it was interesting to note that the small one ran out of steam and became a restriction, while the larger one worked brilliantly and evened out the boost curve all the way to redline." This reflects what the OP was referring to happening in the Volvo High Performance Drive-E Concept above.


    Several months ago, I tried emailing Robftss via his website about adapting his system to a Slingshot, but never got a response. I haven't tried contacting Mr. Knight.

    Edited 3 times, last by BKL: can't seem to type without typos! ().

  • I saw this on EBay last week. Real Electric supercharger Electrical Turbo Charger 2HP Motor | eBay
    It claims that no oil line(s) needed. I wondered about this for this Ebay unit as well as the offerings from Mr. Knight and Robftss since they are essentially turbochargers modified to be driven by an electric motor. All turbo units seem to require an oil supply, yet I haven't seen any reference to how these electric supercharger units are lubed.
    As far as the Ebay unit's performance, it uses an inverter of unspecified capacity to provide 120V from your 12V battery setup (one or more batteries). The motor's power output isn't specified, but a typical powertool motor produces around 1 HP, maybe a little more at 1500W at 120V. This means a current requirement on whatever 12V battery setup is being used of 125 Amps if my math is correct and assuming efficient inverter operation. I used the formula Watts = Current (Amps) x Voltage. At 120V, a 1500W motor would need 12.5A or 125A @ 12V.

    Edited once, last by BKL ().